I could be wrong suspect that for the majority of folks legs and lungs give out (failure) on a constant ramp well before their hearts limit. I tend to reach my max on a more gradual sustained effort like a TT or 20mins test where my legs and lungs don’t fail as they would on a ramp.
For me, I know that once I hit 172bpm… I will not make another three minutes. I usually get somewhere between one and two minutes before my chest feels hollow and, I cant breathe fast enough to support the effort. Every second becomes a max effort and, if I dont stop, I will fall off the bike. So the question is… if I know this through multiple attempts of trying to get more mins at 172bpm, ie a full two or three mins. Why smoke myself knowing I am about to crash in about a minute or two. Thats my red line… its just a matter of time at that point. My power at that red line goes up over time, but the bpm red line stays the same. So couldnt I just assume I’m there at that point and call the test complete? I hope this clarifies the question. I do like the suggestion to just do an hour test. That way I get the benefit of the workout and the FTP together.
if you haven’t done it before, start at an hour.
Agree. My general observation - one of the few, if only, workouts to failure in the TR library is the Ramp Test. So it should be no surprise that on the trainer, you’ll likely see the highest HR on the Ramp Test. Because it is one of the few workouts that is designed for you to go to failure.
Outside on group rides and racing is different of course.
Ah, I see what you’re saying now.
During a ramp test, with 1 min jumps of ~15W, by giving up “now” (the second you hit “workout-max” HR), you could be giving up ~10-20W on your FTP (75% of last minute) if you make it 2 minutes at that HR. That’s a significant difference for most of us.
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Ok… That makes sense
Hey @hoge 
While your HR may consistently be capping off at 172, it is not a reliable metric to assume that you’ve gone all in on that test for the day as it is affected by outside factors such as fatigue, sleep, temperature, stress, etc… so you may still have quite a bit of power to throw down until failure regardless of your HR.
It is also very unlikely to be able to test your true FTP in 3 minutes when the effort is meant to represent the power you can sustain for an hour. This is why different testing protocols use approximations derived from calculated efforts since going as hard as you can for 60 minutes is extremely difficult and fatiguing.
If you’re not keen on doing the Ramp Test, I’d have to agree with the general consensus to find a different type of FTP testing that works for you or keep using AI FTP Detection. As Eddie discussed with you on the “I Still Use Ramp Tests” thread, now that you’re on a training plan after some time off, your AI FTP Detection should be increasing more consistently.
As you complete your workouts, we recommend answering the Post-Workout Surveys honestly and not playing with the answers, as this prevents Adaptive Training from doing its thing as it’s being manipulated instead of working for you.
Additionally, don’t be afraid to use Workout Alternates if the day’s workout seems a bit too much . From your convo with Eddie, it sounds like you’ll be adding unstructured riding, so placing extra care on recovery will be essential to go at the speed of fun and get some long-term sustainable results.
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