saw many questions but only a “we’ve no plans to have multiple FTP’s” answer
I don’t care about multiple FTP’s , just an outdoor FTP to use with outside WO
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Did my first outdoor workout yesterday and I can’t describe how excited I am about this. Completely crushed the workout - lot easier than doing it indoors. More importantly, it’s forcing me to calibrate my efforts and better understand what it feels to do 450 watts for 60 seconds and then recover. The same is true of doing sweet spot on the road. It feels completely different from doing the same efforts indoors. As someone who uses erg mode exclusively indoors, that type of calibration is incredibly important and valuable.
The MVP is amazing. Now get us head unit integration PLEASE!!! I’m begging for Wahoo integration. Begging, pleading, exhorting (pick your favorite verb). Pretty please?
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By definition, an Inside and Outside FTP would be two FTP’s… i.e. multiple. 
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I don’t get the indoor vs outdoor FTP argument. Riding outside doesn’t magically make you stronger. In my experience all of my power PRs are inside. Sometimes I’ll hit a power PR outside, but it’s generally followed by an even higher number next time I’m inside. I almost wonder if it comes down to motivation inside vs being distracted from the pain outside? For instance, I seem to be able to hit numbers in Zwift races with relative ease that I would definitely be hurting from if I had just used the TR software. I do understand that everyone is different though, so my experiences are not true for everyone.
I do wonder though, if two FTPs were used. Wouldn’t this really throw off the TSS charts? It seems to me that it would be better to just set the FTP based on the indoor ramp test and then adjust the intensity outdoors if needed.
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I know , what I was saying is that I don’t ask a complex, multiple, FTP system but just to use another FTP only for Outside WO: so just a fixed, single, value to use when I change a WO from inside to outside
could I ask you what PM are you using inside and which outside?
Has anyone tried a Ramp Test outside yet?
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I have considered it, but finding a location with a proper length and grade is a challenge for me.
- From what I gather, that is less common. More people seem to get their PR’s outside. There are multiple reasons for this.
- One is possible motivation differences. As you note, many people get much more enjoyment and distraction when outside as compared to inside. That can be a huge impact that I suspect is the largest contributor in the differences. Even if they know the benefits of inside riding, it is merely a means to another end (fitness gains meant for application outside).
- Another is the type of riding done. Most people are executing structured training workouts. These are more likely to be sub-peak efforts in many cases. If a person is doing things like racing in Zwift, they are more likely to hit PR’s inside. But there are a large number of people who only “train” inside. As such, the bulk of their PR’s will come from riding outside.
- The other major factor is cooling. Even with the increased knowledge from the podcast, I think too many people are using insufficient cooling for their inside setups. This will almost certainly limit the peak power compared to outside (assuming “normal” conditions).
All the above are factors that lead to real differences in the “Effective FTP” that a person has while inside vs outside. We should do what we can to bring them closer (usually try to lift the Inside FTP towards the Outside FTP), but we should also recognize that some delta may well be present in many cases.
As such, a different value may well be appropriate. I am not enough of a math/training pro to know the ultimate impact of having split FTP values on TSS or other training effects. In general, if the delta is large enough, it may mean that efforts on one side or the other (based on which specific FTP is in place) may be over or under the desired power zone. That can impact the TSS and overall training picture.
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As a software developer, I can tell you that going from 1 → 2 is the hard part. 2 → 100 is usually easier.
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All very good points.
I have my cooling pretty dialed inside. I have two of those fans they always talk about on the podcast and I’m set up in my basement where it’s always uncomfortably cold for the first five minutes of my ride.
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I have a Trek Emonda w/ a Stages left side power meter.
Inside I ride that on my Cycleops Fluid 2, outside I ride it on well the road.
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as a sw developer for 30y, the hard part is to create a complex multiple FTP system, with different TSS and so on
what I’m asking for is just a single value to use for outside WO and and nothing else: as if I manually raised the FTP value in some (outside) WO
Sorry, but I still don’t know what you think the difference is here.
There’s more to this - and any feature request - than simply the development effort.
A product has to align to a vision. The TR vision is a single FTP. Not to mention the aesthetic.
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Maybe a way round this would be to offload the FTP logic to Garmin/Wahoo. Since the workout will need to be pushed to your device from Garmin Connect – whether you’ve created it manually, or TR has used the new API to push it to Connect – it would make sense to use the value set there to populate the target zones.
We’re working with Wahoo to get their integration done ASAP.
Here’s an update for outside workouts on a Garmin:
We’re pretty close to getting this done. We can send workouts today for TR employees. We have some UI work to do to make sure we have everyone re-authorize their Garmin OAuth so we have permission.
We are also building the outside workouts. We’re doing a more of a 1:1 between the inside TR workout and the outside TR workout based on feedback.
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TR is awesome
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Aww, shucks, thanks!! 
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can’t wait to do a ramp test outside 
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