Statement from Wahoo via @GPLama latest YouTube video:
Wahoo statement on KICKR V5:
“The technical details of why we have not brought this functionality to v5:
The Zwift Virtual Shifting capability depends upon a custom communication protocol called Zwift Protocol. It’s a bespoke protocol that Zwift invented and virtual shifting is only possible via that protocol. When we did our preliminary assessment, we believed that we could add this protocol successfully into KICKR v5. Unfortunately, it has proven infeasible because the storage space on our PCBA is insufficient to accommodate our existing code base plus the size of the Zwift Protocol on top of that. We tried to run this and it led to overall instability issues which caused the KICKR to crash unexpectedly. The memory storage was upgraded when we built v6 because we also had to add Wifi as part of v6 as well. So in other words, the PCBA of v6 is different from prior KICKRs. We have assessed our code base and believe we could not make both Zwift Protocol and the existing KICKR firmware code fit, even with extensive code optimization. Unfortunately there is not a path here.”
What iPhone do you have? Because according to Apple the newest phone that is labeled as “Vintage” is the iPhone X, which came out in 2017. Which means the youngest iPhone that won’t get updates is 7 years old. And that’s releasing a new model every single year. The fact that Wahoo literally only has two models of the Kickr Bike, and three total versions (Bike v1, Bike v2, and Shift), and can’t even provide support for the previous model year is terrible. The equivalent situation for Apple would be releasing the iPhone 16 and then soon after ending support for the 15. They aren’t. They provide support back to 6 years ago. If Wahoo was putting out a new bike every year maybe it’s a different story, but phones and items like a Kickr Bike are so different. People buy the trainer or bike to last for years and years. Some people are getting new iPhones every year. Not everybody, but the percentage getting a new phone every 1 to 2 years is likely way larger than people buying a new trainer every year.
From my experience it’s more likely that there are people so unhappy with their v1 bikes and can’t afford a new one! (I’m so grateful they bought my bike back. (Oh so grateful) But I do get your idea. Just the thought that there are people who have several of the v1 and probably v2 bikes is kind of sickening.
If they had refused, and I lived in a big scuba diving location, I would consider casting the base in cement and putting it underwater, somewhere where people could see it and try to ride it with their fins on. At least someone could enjoy it.
I saw @GPLama report on the Wahoo updates. He did have a really short mention of why the v1 bike isn’t getting new firmware. It seemed to be a notice from Wahoo corporate, and I can’t find it on Wahoo’s site. Looking…
The V1 hasn’t had an update since April 2022: 1.27.0
Since that time, the V2 has had 6 updates!! SIX!!! One plus 5!
I’m happy with my v1 bike but I wouldn’t buy another. I hate the thought of moving with it or dealing with it if it breaks. Hopefully well into the future when it dies, I’ll just go back to some direct drive trainer that I can toss in the closet
I agree Wahoo should provide support for the Kickr Bike v1. And they do… don’t they? (I have no idea, I thought we were talking about one specific function). I was just bringing up the point that technology ages out pretty quick (and used phones, which in my opinion are really expensive for how long they last, as an example.
But while we are here… Apple is a trillion dollar company. They built a campus HQ that is probably worth more than wahoo as a company. And it is crazy to think people are buying thousand dollar phones every year or two. How did we get here?
This is strange isn’t it? Is v1 so different from v2 that you can’t send other updates? If v1 has something go wrong does wahoo try to help or offer a v2 replacement or is it just like… “sorry, not sorry”?
Priorities change after two bankruptcies and several rounds of layoffs.
Also, how many trainers are out there versus trainer bikes? Working on bugfixes/features for the bike probably helps 1/100th (maybe even 1/1000th?) the number of people. Sad realities of a niche product from a company with several years of poor management under their belt.
Speaking of Apple, people are ‘chipping’ older macs so they can upgrade the memory which makes me wonder how hard it would be to upgrade the memory on a v1 bike board, and then ‘bless’ it with the sheen of a v2. The chip upgrade wouldn’t seem to be much of a challenge, but the ‘blessing’ would take more than a wand from Glenda the good witch…
In my past life I dealt with upgrading firmware for a device that had really old hardware tech in it. I don’t doubt Wahoo’s explanation, as I’ve literally had to decompose trig functions into their infinite series and then figure how few terms in the series I could get away with using because calling the trig functions was too computationally intensive for the system. I’m not excusing what they said, I’m just saying I believe the reason.
I also don’t think you could take the v6 firmware and load it on a v5 (assuming you had the space) and get it to work, unless every other component was the same, and every filter was scaled exactly the same.
I ran into a bug after upgrading the control system software which only manifested itself if you executed a series of commands in a specific order and timeline. The bug turned out to a result of me changing a gain in the system, and a filter somewhere else in the code not getting rescaled. So if you executed the specific sequence you could get this one filter to overflow memory and crash the system. This took me three week to debug as it only showed up in the hardware in the loop lab, and all I had for output was a strip chart
I got involved in NIC drivers in the days of 10base2. It was packet driver stuff. Most of it I seem to have forgotten as it was nothing glamorous. We were running Mosaic for a browser, and Gopher, Veronica and Jughead, Kermit, Fetch, and so many other programs I’ve forgotten. Yeah, THAT old stuff would be a no-go today, but the chances that the v1 main board used something so radically out of date compared to the new v2 board isn’t as likely as people might think. It was more than likely designed, engineered, and produced at the same turnkey Vietnam facility that still likely makes them now this very day. I’m sure they are like most companies of that ilk, and try to straddle the need of the ‘name brand’, and their need for cheap build. Plus, even if they did swap for a faster better chip on the v2 board, the idea that the memory would be radically different isn’t likely possible. Wahoo didn’t pay them to reinvent the world, they paid them to crank out another shiny thing for rich people to buy. Who knows…
Someone have a v1 bike that they want to donate to the cause? How about a v2 bike too?
Point is they likely did not redesign the mainboard to use radically newer chips, they likely just added more memory, and maybe an evolutionary bump in the main processor chipset possibly to support DirectConnect.
The average length of the iPhone upgrade cycle has more or less doubled during the recent years. It is two to three years now, but still quite a short time. Luckily a three year old iPhone is not actually old: I use my ”old” iPhone for another three years as my bike phone that I carry with me when riding.
I still can’t believe they won’t even offer an upgrade path. What about letting us decide between a firmware that omits ANT+ and includes Zwift protocol?
Bunch of BS. I’m interested in KICKR Run…. But you can bet I won’t buy it since I can’t be sure there will be any support.
I also am extremely interested in ELEMNT Ace. Maybe I won’t get that either.
Wahoo knew they put out a beta product and have now stopped supporting it.
