Changelog now says “Minor bug fixes”.
Yesterday app said “Stability improvements”
1 Like
Same here with “Stability Improvements”. Ride yesterday started with Kickr reading 3-4% higher than Assioma pedals (first 20 of 120 mins), and ended with them in sync (0.1%) in the last 20 mins.
New firmware/app/etc. and consistent outcome today. ~10 watts low for first 30 mins and then rather than drift up it seemed to almost “snap” to within a watt or two at an interval change ~30mins in and then drift a watt or two higher over rest of ride. All in all this is pretty close and acceptable for long rides (slightly easier warm up) but not great for short (<60 min) interval rides.
No impact from a bathroom break (coasting) at ~2:30:00 in.
1 Like
It’s frustrating because the main reason I upgraded to the kickr was because I didn’t want to wait 15min for it to warm up - but now I seem to have to wait 40mins instead 
I think the kickr reading 4% lower is reasonable given drive train losses - its the drift in the delta that is the issue for me.
I know I’ve got the (very good) option of using power match but I spent £1000 on something and I want it to be right and I love a good experiment 
This got me thinking though… trainerroad will have a vast amount of data from people using a kickr v5 and using powermatch. They would be able to spot if this drift is widespread among kickr users and perhaps feed the data back to Wahoo if it is?
Who’s button do I pess? @IvyAudrain maybe? 
Just got my wahoo kickr and then found my way to this thread…since I’m still in my return window, if you were me, would you return your kickr and get something else like a Tacx? Would you think that would be more reliable?
I’m not sure. I actually found this “issue” within my return period but decided to keep it anyway. I figured all trainers have there own issues and that wahoo seem to have a good reputation regarding getting faulty trainers swapped.
Well, it seems like all trainers have their own little issues.
Based on my own data (1xKickr18, 2xKickr20, Neo2 and Neo2T) I would say that from an accuracy point the Neos are better. But looking at my own data know, the Kickr20 drifts less than 1% if I subtract the first 15 mins/warm up. I would say its helpfull to compare your trainer vs a PM, but that goes for all trainers… If I just jumped on my Kickr20 and took a ramp test now I would get a result that was too high.
From an outside view the failure rate of trainers seems very high. So I would choose a brand that has good support. Wahoo seems to replace those faulty units fairly quick.
Based on what I have read in the Neo owners group on FB, it seems like at least the Neo 2T are having problems with overheating, so they are not perfect either.
I could have bought a Neo2T when I got my first Kickr20 replaced, but chose to keep the Kickr20.
I’ve come to peace with it… I just ignore the gap between devices for first couple intervals knowing it will converge. Outside of this been very happy with the Kickrv5. The long rides do seem more comfortable with the squishy feet, it’s almost silent, the feel is good to me. The multiple BT devices is helpful.
Really? or is this just a bias because those with issues talk about it and those that don’t stay quiet?
I would love to see some data on this, but i suspect its a lot lower than what forums make it out to be.
I dont know of course. Im aware that people without issues tend to stay quiet.
But the number of issues Im reading about in both Wahoo and Tacx owners group seems very high. It is very common to see people that have gotten their trainers replaced 3-4 times.
Personally I have had several trainers replaced, Kickr Snap(noise), Neo2(power reading 10% high), Neo2T(noise) and Kickr20(noise), and I have never owned a trainer for more than 1 year.
I had a Neo, ‘upgraded’ to the Kickr20 and have tried to see this drifting issue on my unit and it just isn’t there. I’m not implying it doesn’t exist on other posters machines, just saying it’s not universal. It’s a personal thing but I’m marginally happier with the Kickr than the Neo, in my mind they both function as well as each other in the fundamentals, I just prefer the feel of the Kickr.
As for which is more reliable, no idea, forums are full of anecdotes but there’s no way to extrapolate failure rates of different brands/models from info publicly available.
1 Like
Cross-posting to another thread where I’ve found similar issues with my KICKR V5: KICKR V5 power discrepancies
The behaviour seems quite erratic, but my latest observation shows a similar drift from 0 to 12 W difference vs a crank-based PM over the course of a 60 minute ERG mode workout: DC Rainmaker Analyzer
I seem to have run across this same issue with my Kickr v5. I picked up a v5 a few months back. I started a short power build phase last month and started really struggling with the v02 max workouts. I’d be fine for the first few intervals but have to reduce the intensity during the last half of the workout.
A couple weeks ago I bought a p2m NG Eco. I was curious how they compare and started recording workouts using both. What I saw in yesterday’s workout was really interesting. I “failed” on the 5th interval having to bail out about 30 seconds early. I then reduced the intesity by 2% and was able to complete the workout.
Looking at the data afterwards, you can see that the wahoo reads steady but the power recorded by the p2m starts increasing in the 3rd interval. It’s not a huge drift (I zoomed in on the 5th interval below), but it doesn’t take much when you’re at 120% of ftp. This could explain why I’ve been struggling in the back half of workouts during the build phase.
I did a factory spindown today and will see if that makes any difference. In general the kickr reads higher than the p2m, which is backwards. I inreased the power reading using the ngeco app to match the kickr for this workout to make the data interpretation a bit easier. I may just use the powermatch to drive the trainer moving forward, but I suppose I might have to do another ramp test to calibrate with the p2m (ugh!).
I’ll also add that all of this is done on my mountain bike, which means the gearing is low and so are the flywheel speeds. Not sure if that’s part of the issue.
1 Like
Very similar to my experience. I’m going to try pointing a fan directly at the flywheel to see if that makes any difference.
Factory spindown restore good work of powermeter of my KickrV5 after I must change belt tension mechanism. Without it Kickr was reporting +5% to Assioma Duo.
Has anyone experienced a big increase/decrease in power readings from the Kickr after doing a factory spindown?
My PMs (2xQuarq+Assiomas) has been reading about 1% lower than my Kickr for several months, decided to do a factory spindown (stupid me) and now my PMs are reading 5-6% higher than the Kickr, sweetspot workouts has become threshold workouts etc…
No I have been doing serveral factory spindowns but nothing changes, doesnt matter what temperatur my trainer holds…
Anyone? @GPLama you are mentioning factory spindowns in newest YT-video 
I’ve been trying to track this. I get consistent drift in workouts. I always run TR with powermatch to my quarq and then have been running zwift off of my kickr in cases where I use my PM with an ant only or just to check power meter offsets out of curiosity.
It seems like the kickr needs a spin down every 20-30 min or so to auto calibrate again. I’ve done that and get readings within 1% to my quarq generally.
I haven’t don’t any factory spin downs on the kickr though. I’m on v5 too.
Not sure, but i am surprised how this is not adressed by Wahoo. In TR i am Running my Assioma as Power Meter and the Kickr only for resistance. And Zwift i use the Kickr for the Power, and there you see the drift.
I think the Kickr V5 gets no chance to do the Auto Calibration during the Workout. Because you never Freewheel or spinndown during the workout. So after a time the System get hot and needs a calibration, but the Auto calibration can never start because in the workout we constantly pedal.
The Power difference is around 10 or more Watts if i remember it correctly.
I actually did test this and gave the Kickr a chance to spinndown and after that it was in range again like it was at the start.
Would be nice if @GPLama can do a test regarding this. And see if it is a issue in exactly that use case. During normal Ride on Zwift without Workout mode ERG, this problem is not existent.
How you Tag People here so the Lama may read this ;)? And save us we need someone to look into it.
I actually seem to have managed to do a factory spindown that appears to have fixed the issue I was reporting above - I’m never going to do another factory spindown again.
However, what you are talking about is slightly different. You are correct that you do need to trigger an auto cal after 10mins or so for accurate readings. I don’t find this to be an issue, I just stop pedalling 10mins into the workout and count to 4 - that does the trick.
It can run its cal before the TR workout pauses 
2 Likes
I will try this you think 4 sec. is enough? Just wondering since a normal spindown take a lot longer no?
Just kills my during a long 20 or 30 min sweetspot session when i have the feeling the Watts are eventually of by + 10W 
and it is harder the longer the Workout goes.
Another better way without us having to do something would be so much better and that would be what i understand under Auto Calibration 
but i guess from now on during all Recovery valleys i get a extra few Seconds rest, i just hope Coach Chad and AT will understand haha