Tiagra, Sora, Cues are all very nice groups. My wife has 9sp Sora on her Giant Devote- it’s great. Not good, great. The only durability concern are the jockey wheels (bushings vs bearing), which are a wear item anyway. otherwise they are MORE durable groups. I say buy Tiagra with confidence.
Someone said grx400 (Tiagra level) shifting isn’t great, but that’s more of a function of the large steps in the cassette than the group. With any big cassette jump towards a smaller cog, you go from release 1 chain link worth of slack to 2 or 3 links worth of slack in to the space between the cassette and crank under tension. If you want better shifting on big cassettes, Shimano HG+ and Srams T-Type MTB cassettes are a solution to this (Maybe LinkGlide too.)
10s Tiagra 4700 uses the same cable pull as 11s, the derailleur is 10s/11s so to upgrade to 11s you only need to change cassette, chain and shifters. I suspect the next Tiagra refresh will see it go to 11s
11s mech 105 is no longer listed on the Shimano site
Lower cost materials, looser tolerances and finish on cheap groupsets says otherwise. I can feel the difference in shifting, its nicer on high end on groupsets, the shifting action is lighter and more positive.
Yup. I get the basic concept that 10s/11s shifters are all equal in form and function, but my direct experience tells different. The literal interaction with the controls is notably different between my R8000 and R7000 groups. Both are great and overall high quality, but there is detectable refinement in the R8000.
Much of this comes down to the blend materials, tolerances and other processing that make these very similar products just different enough that I can appreciate the higher level version. I expect a similar delta may exist in the Tiagra to 105 type step, but have no direct experience there.
Main point is that despite being “the same” gearing, concept and core implementation, there is more hiding in the real parts and function. Added to that are things like longer term durability and function at a similar level to new compared to a higher level of degradation over time from use.
I guess, part of my complaint is that I have a mechanical Ultrega 11s on the road bike, all Jagwire pro cables new, and it’s unbelievable. It’s light, precise, quick and always spot on, no “false changes”, no fine-tuning every once in a while, always perfect.
The GRX’s lever is hard, and constantly when I shift up, when the lever passes the click to change, it usually doesn’t change the gear right away. I need to pull a tiny bit more so that the derailer moves and changes. The problem is that when I move that tiny bit more it’s common to “advance” to the second click - going up or down two gears. And that is annoying.
Before the question no, I don’t believe fine-tuning will solve it as I already did it from scratch - new cable, hanger checked, etc. I’ve been riding for almost 10 years and do 95% of my maintenance. Never had this issue. So either the lever is defective, as suggested and possibly be the case, or I am so used to the Ultegra.
That sounds like cable drag to me. There are two things I do when I get a new bike in my house - changes the tires and Jagwire polished pro cable (or ultraslick) . I may even change the housing if I don’t like it.
Usually with that action, the issue is buildup where the cable enters the shifter or the housing liner is smashed where it was cut. Also, don’t some Shimanos shifters of this era have a cable fray design flaw?
The other thing on the 11-34 11speed cassette specifically… it is a MTB cassette used for road. If you’re using it on an 11sp Road hub, you need to use the 1.8mm spacer that you’d normally need to use for 10sp cassettes on 11sp road freehub bodies. If you don’t use it, the cassette can be slightly or very loose.
And I agree, it sounds like cable drag to me too. Sometimes when I’m in the 34 teeth and shift down, the derailleur is a bit “lazy”. If I tried to fine-tune it and lose a bit of tension, then the change from the 11 to 12 teeth is compromised. Again, the hanger is fine, so it really appears cable. I’ll check the bike shop first, but I’m planning to replace all the housing for Jagwaire ultra-slick for sure. It makes a huge difference.
11/12 shifts are totally cable issues. There’s very little tension on the cable there.
I can agree that Shifter feel on Shimano road Sora, Tiagra, 105, Ultegra, etc are going to feel more pronounced as the lever materials are quite different… and Shimano road shifters with their separate up/down shift levers feel quite chintz compared to any SRAM shift/brake feel.
Double check your limit screws adjustment. Try backing off the upper limit screw just a bit (up on the 34 end of the cassette). Then re-adjust cable tension as necessary and road test. You may be up against the upper limit screw too much, requiring too much tension to get into the 34. This then compromises the shifting at the lower end.
You’ll lose just as much as a % of the brand new price if you buy Tiagra bike as you will if you buy 105 equipped bike.
The bigger issue is just the flooded market for second hand bikes, moreover than people not wanting to “make a mistake with Tiagra”.
Your friend will get a solid turn out of Tiagra or GRX etc. My lad runs 9 speed Sora and even that is perfectly functional. The small incremental differences in shift quality won’t affect a new person’s enjoyment of cycling. If any bike with Claris or above has issues with shifting then it’s the set up and not that a groupset it rubbish/poor quality. Some of that set up might be inherent in poor cable routing design but that comes down to reading the reviews and choosing a well thought out bike as a whole. In reality few manufacturers get it wrong nowadays.
Sure, groupsets wear out and the cheaper ones have lower quality materials but if your friend does a few thousand miles on a bike and looks after it, the groupset won’t be the thing making or breaking their cycling experience.
That is one thing that I was told early on. ‘What’s the difference between Ultegra and Dura Ace?’ Well, Dura Ace is lighter, and more fragile. It’s a good thing that those that use it have sponsors. They’ll need it for sure!
But having Ultegra DI2, price can’t be a big issue as the bike probably cost a bunch. So I use the Ultegra cassettes and chains on it when it’s on the trainer because it really is a heck of a lot quieter. HOWEVER there is a lot more expected maintenance that needs to happen too. Keeping the chain clean and properly lubed, etc. From what I remember of the 105 Cannondale I had, it ran quiet on SRAM or Shimano chains, and the 105 cassettes would last many seasons. Same with chain rings. 105 was like the workhorse of bikes, and it took a beating on so many bikes. Including mine. I ran SRAM chains on my Ultegra mechanical groupset and it was pretty quiet and lasted a long time. I tried the same on Ultegra DI2 and it sure seemed noisier. It quieted down with the official Shimano chain.
