Any reason why you’re still using the ramp test when most of the polarized models relate to power derived from an actual 60 min effort?
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Scott, I think 2 on / 1 off makes great sense. I may well be in trouble with my 3 weeks, just because I had a solid one before my official POL start.
For sure, no impact on any training in general.
It’s more interesting info that applies in the Zwift world.
I’m aware Dr. Siler supports the full 60 minute test. But for a host of reasons, I am unwilling to do it. There are plenty of ways you can get poor data from that test too. Duration on its own is not a singular reason to choose or disregard a test, IMHO.
I like the Ramp Test simplicity and repeatable nature for one thing. I’m more than comfortable using it for FTP approximation and applying it to the POL model. Dr. Siler used a power based definition when outlining his chart in FT Ep 54, about 25 to 35 mins into the episode.
The mere fact that I am working most of my power values away from the “lines” means that I should be fine, even if I’m not “exact” on my FTP.
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W/kg is more interesting in the real world, where physics and aerodynamics rule! A lot of Zwifters lying about weight in my experience, guys that kick my ass in virtual world are off the back on club rides.
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Yeah, lots of fibbers in Z, but I don’t care about them. I focus on my effort and only watch w/kg as a side element and somewhat useful in pack riding.
It’s about worthless to me in real life as most of my competition lacks power meters and don’t know their stats.
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Yup, in our club we all know who is riding together after a big climb 
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Awesome stuff Chad. I look forward to reading about how things go.
Curious - how much does your heart rate increase over the course of your 4 hour rides?
First ride: Log In to TrainerRoad
- 131 bpm avg for whole workout @ 152w avg
- 123 bpm avg for first 25 min int @ 144w avg
- 140 bpm avg for last 28 min int @ 144w avg
- 17 bpm increase on the last interval
Second ride: Log In to TrainerRoad
- 127 bpm avg for whole workout @ 158w avg
- 119 bpm avg for first 25 min int @ 151w avg
- 133 bpm avg for last 28 min int @ 151w avg
- 14 bpm increase on the last interval
I hadn’t looked that close, but its interesting to see a lower HR across the board for the second ride, and a lower increase from first to last interval in it as well.
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Can you explain ‘Session Time’ more fully.
Thanks.
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Do you know how a rocker plate compares to a KK Rock & Roll (which I have)?
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Interesting on the 2nd ride about the HR. 3 possibilities spring to mind
- Polarised is obviously working LOL.!!!
- Your 2nd ride was after a VO2 max ride the previous day which resulted in fatigue and a depressed HR . Not really sure about that though.
- HR is unreliable to train with
I’m really going to enjoy following this thread. Thanks for doing it and sharing.
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Season Goal is about grouping a workout based in the primary focus and intent of the workout.
A typical Z3 session (high intensity) will include a warmup, cool down and recovery intervals that are all well below the Z3 work intervals. But if the goal of the session and bulk of the “work” is Z3, then it is a Z3 because of the Session goal.
Likewise, if you do a 2 hour Z1 low intensity ride, but decide to do a few hard efforts or sprints for fun, it is still a Z1 Session.
You count these sessions in either Zone, and add up the total session time. That should be about 80% time for Z1, 15-20% time for Z3, and less than 5% for Z2.
The main point is it is about the overall session goal and NOT the specific minutes in each zone. If you count that fine, the percentage splits are more like 90/10 or 95/5.
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Based on my testing with a friends R&R, they are similar but different.
I dislike the bounce that happens on some R&R models. It is due to the location of their pivot support being behind the axle. I made mine a full support, and a rigid hinge, to eliminate any bounce.
I also settled on air springs, that allow for very small adjustments and leveling better. A common issue I hear from R&R riders is the feeling of always leaning. I think their center-only spring makes leveling more difficult.
Other that that, they work basically the same. I’ve just refined my design to suit my preferences.
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Ha, great thoughts and I agree with all three: P
Yeah, I dont really thin 1 is likely after only one week. But it is possible I could be adapting in general to longer training rides inside, considering how many I did in the last few weeks
My lead in to each one was definitely different, so that’s not a great controlled approach. The variation alone could be the reason.
And totally agree in 3 as its bot a huge variation, so easily covered by possible diet, sleep, etc. I do think I did a better job hydrating in the 2nd ride and may have been better to start as well.
Either way, no amazing conclusions, but interesting at least. Might be cool to watch the Longfellow ones and see how I react to those as well.
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This made me take a look at HR over some of my recent rides using TR and a KICKR. I record HR but I don’t reference it all that much day to day. Plenty of variation though, using that 3 zone model it is more than enough to muddy the line between zone 2 and 3 for sure. Looking at a couple of files from BAGO for example the 3 min interval isn’t long enough for my HR to climb that high, but based on everything else I feel pretty confident that I had the ERG (FTP) set plenty high enough. I don’t have much on the trainer at around FTP recently but I did have one file where I was doing SST just below for about 30 minutes and my avg HR there was higher than my max doing intervals on BAGO a couple of times. Lot of variables there but just giving an example of what might be seen.
From what I’ve seen the last few days I’d feel fine about using HR to help me define the top of Zone 1, unless I was to charge out of the gate and go around FTP before my HR had a chance to catch up, I think it would work ok. But on the other end I think all of the limitations of referencing HR start to come into play. But I’ll definitely keep recording.
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Just as a matter of interest @mcneese.chad, what was your hydration like on the 4 hour ride. I just did Baxter and was actually quite shocked to see that I had lost 700cc of water in 90 minutes. 2 good fans and not particularly hot either.
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I came in from drinking plenty of water before bed. Normal urination in the morning.
8oz of coffee right at the start of the ride and finished in the first half-hour. Then on to drinking about 28-34oz through the entire ride. (I finished one 24oz bottle and a got bit into the second one).
I get cold outside air from a window and had my usual combo 2 fans for easy riding. I did add the 3rd fan in the last 45 mins as the room seemed to get warmer.
Just finished 3 weeks of traditional base 1 which starts with 2.25 hour rides, then 2.5 hour rides, then 2.75 hour rides. Garage is mid to upper 70s in the afternoon. During the ride I usually drink 4 bottles / 84 ounces (two 24oz bottles, one 20oz bottle, and one 16oz bottle). Outside rides are fine with one 24oz bottle an hour.
I need a second fan!
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if you therefore sweat in a similar manner to me then (and I do not consider myself a heavy sweater) you could have lost approx 28 -30oz of water maybe. Could this partially account for the raised HR during the ride.
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