Maybe I was too quick to respond. I agree that it can be useful. I definitely have rides where I use it as a barometer of fitness but, i feel it should be used carefully, like heart rate, there are too many variables that can affect it. And I have to remind myself that with excess climbing and head winds it’s going to be low.
Not trying to take away from anyone’s tips to help some one go faster!
@dpues Great job so far! If you are compliant, medium volume is awesome. I went from 264 FTP in August to my all time best of 333 FTP now. So it most definitely works.
Just to add what others have said - Don’t be scared but respect the program that Coach Chad set up. When I signed up originally for TR in January 2019, I didn’t listen and tried to do high volume and ignored the diet and recovery recommendations. I had been HighFat\LowCarb for over a year at the time (with great gains at the time I might add) and thought I knew better. Long story short, started digging a over-training hole in middle of SSBHV2 and adjusted to mid-vol in attempt to save it. Once Build Phase hit - started failing to complete most workouts ultimately quitting exchanging TR workouts for riding outside since it was summer.
Here are my biggest takeaways for my turnaround from utter failure to really getting a grasp of this beast called TrainerRoad:
Pick the volume that you feel you can commit to near 100% of the time prioritizing it over outdoor rides. In other words, let outdoor rides be negotiable and TR workouts are non-negotiable. Don’t be ashamed to pick a low volume plan if you feel that is all you can do to be as close as 100% compliant as possible. for me, I felt mid-vol would be a fit if I could do the workouts Mon-Fri based on my work schedule. I got the idea from Coach Jonathan where he explains he ties all his workouts into Mon-Fri, leaving the weekend for a rest day and a outdoor ride day. So for mid-vol, I made my schedule in plan builder follow Monday-Difficult, Tuesday-Difficult, Wednesday-Moderate, Thursday-Difficult(longer), and Friday-Difficult)longer. This has worked for me and I still follow this layout.
Endurance Diet - Eat Everything, Eat Quality, Eat Carb-Centered, Eat Enough, Eat Individually. Endurance Diet is a game-changer. I started eating high quality of everything (carbs\fat\proteins) I could using MyFitnessPal to track macros and calories. I allowed myself to eat plenty carbs based upon the next days workout. I allowed myself to over-eat a couple hundred calories on the day before tough workouts. This was especially true in build phase. I was so full at times going to bed it just didn’t seem right. It was crazy to lose weight in the build phase eating as much as I was. When you eat quality low calorie nutrient dense whole food - it is amazing the amount you need to eat to sustain the workload. I used MFP as a general guide to help make sure I was not under fueling. I also learned that cheese and milk are kryptonite for me. they cause me inflammation and increase phlegm hurting my breathing during workouts. Other forms of dairy don’t effect me much. So pay attention to what you are feeding your body and be aware of foods to avoid. Final note on diet - HFLC\Keto does have its place for some based upon their goals and how active they are. It seems to me that initially it works for recreational endurance athletes because it is acts as a elimination diet of the crap carbs they didn’t realize they were eating to begin with. I see now that was the case for me. Plus, you can’t hit the threshold and above workouts without enough carbs.
Approaching Rest\Recovery with the same intensity as training\diet. I use a combo of Emfit QS + Polar Vantage M watch + HRV4Training to track my sleep, HRV, and recovery. I use them as tools to see how my body reacts to less\more sleep, caffeine, eating late, eat healthy vs unhealthy, training amount, etc. It’s amazing what you learn about yourself when you start tracking to manage. I also use a sleep mask and ear plugs along with a matress cooler to keep my core temp down at night. Matress Cooler is a game changer that I cannot live without - my best scores in my tools above came after using the Matress Cooler. They had to send me a replacement pad so went without it for about a week. Scores tanked and I could feel it.
Anyway, hope this helps someone…lol
I would look at your power sources. You are saying you did 233 for 2.5 hours with an FTP of 248. One (or both) of those 2 numbers is off or you are the worst FTP tester ever (your FTP would need to be higher to be able to hold 233 for 2.5 hours). 94% of FTP for 2.5 hours is just off the charts. I assume you are not using the same power source for these 2 efforts, maybe a power meter and a smart trainer. If you are using the same power source, something might have been off with calibration or something.
Those are great gains any way you slice it, so be happy with the results, but something looks suspect between the outdoor numbers and the FTP test.
That was a concern of mine too. Indoors, I’m using the Elite Suito and Stages PM. Outdoors only the Stages PM. Following some discussions here about the Stages consistently reporting higher wattages than my Elite for the same ride, I turned on Powermatch in TR.
That said, I feel that outdoors I can produce higher wattages for a lower RPE than indoors. Maybe that explains why my numbers outdoors are higher? Maybe my outdoor FTP is higher than my indoor FTP?
Here the Garmin details of the mentioned ride:
Such a simple thing but so many people overlook this, and they are not happy that their progress is not what they expected.
Before I started carb counting prior to workouts I did have instances where I couldn’t properly finish some workouts, under overs especially were always hard for me. Now, after actually having sufficient amount of carbs I dont recall a workout I failed or at least had a really tough time with. Don’t get me wrong, every workout nowadays is still a bitch ( as they should be 
) but it’s always done and dusted to a 100% 
So basically… 
I might actually take away from your post ( really good pointers by the way 
) to start to count and manage my food intake numbers for the entire day. For the time being I’m only doing it for carbs to be well fueled, but still lack that approach as a whole to at least try to maintain my current weight.
Hmmm, this screenshot shows an AVG Power of 233 which is higher than the listed NP of 225. This seems highly unusual to me, especially for such a long ride.
This makes me wonder, how did you set up your powermeter on your headunit, did you choose to INCLUDE, or EXCLUDE the zero power readings, like when coasting? This could artificially inflate your AVG Power and explain a few things regarding your AVG Speed and high AVG Power compared to FTP.
Outdoor FTP being higher than indoors is very common, mostly because of the better cooling when riding outside and not being stuck with a static bike position.
did you choose to INCLUDE, or EXCLUDE the zero power readings
It is setup to exclude the zeroes.
Well, that explains a lot 
I’d highly recommend to include zeros, otherwise you’re just inflating your power numbers, because it doesn’t incude the 0 readings when coasting or backpedaling. Though when you pause or auto pause the power will stop recording, just like everything else.
Think about it. You could be riding uphill at 233W for 0.5 hour and then coasting downhill for another 0.5 hour and it would seem like you did an avg of 233w for 1 hour when in fact this is not the case.
Imo this explains why your avg power is so close to FTP and why your avg speed seems low compared avg power. When in reality your avg power may well have been like 200W or something.
Hope this explains it.
That makes a lot of sense. Changing it right away to include zeroes 
Be prepared for a bit of an ego hit next time your ride outside
I’m not concerned about ego ;-). Just making sure I give my training the best I can and push myself to become the best version of myself that I can be.
Part of that for me is education/learning as I’m new to cycling. I’d like to understand what the data means and why things are what they are. There is so much I learn from these discussions!
There are all sorts of variables but changing things like tyres, position, clothing will help in all situations whether it’s windy, hilly or not. My Nopinz trip skinsuit is the fastest piece of clothing I own (not that I would use it unless I was time trialling) - it is faster than bibs and jersey whether it is hilly, flat windy or still…but of course it is at it’s fastest when it is cool, damp, still and the air pressure on the barometer is dropping like a stone 
First two training sessions of my new Build phase (Collins+1 and Carpathian Peak) done with my new FTP… Those definitely felt a LOT harder than what I’m used to, especially when I look at their TSS (only 66 and 91 :-S). Collins+1 felt more like a tempo training than an endurance one and Carpathian Peak felt like a VO2max session vs a threshold one - lol. I was able to finish them, but it took quite some mental strength and focus. I hope I’ll adapt quickly so the TSS/IF starts aligning more closely to the RPE I’m used to ;-). I realise that the adaptation is all personal and dependent on so many factors, however I was wondering how long it sort of takes your body to get used to the new workload following an FTP bump…
I’m using Whoop to track my HR 24/7, my HRV, sleep and recovery. I’ve been using it since January and so far, pretty happy with the insights I’m getting.
Well done 
Thats all we were implying before, that whilst the ramp is +/- few percent and VO2 max +/- few % as a ratio to FTP accurate to you ie its a good gauge for you as a metric to base all your workouts on and therefore, you should in theory be able to do all the workouts in relation it. your big step in FTP from base to build makes it a bigger mental leap. The whole Base to build is a Mental thing. TR has so much data these plans are going to be doable for 99% of people with minor tweaks based on the relevance of the Ramp and VO2 to you, as we all differ, but TR is a proper training tool and assumes that people are committed and sets the workouts accordingly which sums up “no pain no gain”. Its getting the most out of you for the 99% of us without the need for a personal coach. Thats why Sufferfest and others also work on Mental training because these workouts are tough 
Good luck with the rest. Also there are posts on order of how to cope if you cant. ie Backspin first, before considering to reduce workout difficulty. Better to do 99% of workout at correct intensity, with a few 10-15secs backspins across an interval then drop the whole interval intensity. Ive been there and it makes a huge difference to relief in the legs and lets you get through it.
I think everyone will agree that if you did well on your ramp test, then first week at least is hell. I know for me the second week of build becomes more manageable. Notice I didn’t say easier. I think my mind and body come to a point where they realize that the new RPE will not kill me. What’s nice is the week before recovery week, I’m usually feeling really good and know that I am stronger. Everyone is different though I am sure. Trust the plan and do you best to complete the days workout as close to 100% as you can. Some days you just have to take of a couple percent - doesn’t mean you are not getting stronger. Also, don’t forget that not all TSS is the same, especially in build phase.
Yeah, I looked into Whoop and was not pleased with HRV sampling at the latest SWS (slow-wave-sleep) period of sleep which doesn’t take into account the rest of night or when you wake up. Plus I didn’t like the monthly fee and whoop doesn’t connect to my PM to use my workout watts with the test of recovery. Cross referencing Emfit QS+Polar Vantage M+HRV4Training has worked really well for me and rarely do not all three record a similar pattern in HRV and rest\recovery. Glad whoop is working for your though!
If you have a decent bump then yeah it’s definitely going to be at least a week, with the first few demanding workouts being quite miserable. But after that it’s downhill-ish…
Given you can have an off day or a very good day when you do an FTP test (of whatever flavour) I think you have to be prepared to tweek it along the way. I’ve done six Ramp Tests in this current set of plans and only one has given me a value that I haven’t modified during the subsequent weeks.
If all the workouts feel too easy then bump your FTP by a couple of percent, similarly if they are all killing you and you fail on many drop it by a similar amount. Over-unders are a good litmus test, if your FTP is too low then you never flood your muscles, similarly if it’s too high you don’t clear them.
With a bit of experience (and making workout notes each time) you’ll figure out what’s currently right for you.
So… I’m in the middle of the second week of MV Build following that significant FTP jump early last week (Monday April 20). The workouts at my new FTP are hard but doable. My avg HR during the workouts is obviously higher.
So all good I think…
Over this same period, my RHR has been gradually increasing from around 44 to today 57… In the past, sports doctors told me that monitoring RHR is a good way to identify overtraining and they suggested that if it goes up more than 10% day over day and does not go down the days after, I may be overtraining and should focus more on recovery than training.
Should I be worried about overtraining at this point? Or is this expected and sort of desired following an FTP increase of +12% and is my body just trying to adapt? Or is this expected going into Build in general as the intensity of the sessions increases? Should I drop the intensity of the training sessions, even though they are still manageable?
