If you do a full hour long 20min test the standard percentage is 95%. The one I done has 30s @120%, 30s @ maximal (circa 135-140%) and 1min @ 120+130% (or as hard as you can to clear aerobic energy), then the 20 min test. The TR version has 1min @ 100%, 1min @105%, 1 min @ 110% and 5mins @110% (a longer but less intense period also to clear aerobic energy) then the 20min test. 95% of the 20min is norm for the TR version.
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Thank you for that post. It helped me understand the process a lot more.
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for the 20-min test some coaches use a range:
“We take the average 20 minute power and subtract 5 – 10% to arrive at an athlete’s 60 minute “Functional Threshold Power” or FTP. As a generally rule of thumb we use 5% for slow twitch aerobic athletes and 10% for athletes that have a well developed anaerobic system. We’ll subtract 7.5% if we don’t know about the athlete’s anaerobic capacity.”
source: A 20 Minute Power-Based Field Test – FasCat Coaching
so multiply 20-min average power by .9 on the low-end (= subtract 10%), and multiply by .95 for a slow-twitch athlete (= subtract 5%).
This is a long-shot, but if you have WKO and some good data then there is a chart “Aerobic and Anaerobic Contribution to Power Bike” that will give you the multiplier.
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Awesome… thank you for the explanation!
Johnny to sum this all up am I right in saying that for a T Trialist a 20 minute FTP test is better than the ramp test because it does not stress your vo2max capabilities which the ramp test exposes? Sorry to go over this but I am not really into data and a lot of it is over my head. Thanks for your help is there any other articles applicable to this that might help? cheers
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I’m a tter and have always performed badly at the ramp test compared to the 20 min test. Doing some comparisons recently the ramp test had me around 30 watts lower. The older I get the worse the ramp test is. Currently 51.
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Hi Michelle, I’m not at your level but I’m another big fan of the Kolie Moore test, I just use the first one in the article someone else linked. I think the ramp overestimates my FTP for reasons discussed already.
If I had no idea what my FTP was I’d use the ramp but if I knew the ballpark I would go straight to the KM test protocol. I’m also a big fan of his use of RPE (as is coach Chad I think). In this case as another way to ‘set’ the correct difficulty of intervals.
I feel like my threshold training is easier now (more accurate FTP), so I end up with more time in zone in a session and hope that as a result it it more effective. It’s certainly enjoyable! Good luck.
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Yes, the pacing component makes it easier to do. What I am wondering is if this is not as stressful as going at FTP until exhaustion?
It takes some time to figure it all out, but after almost a year of LV on TR I finally decided to switch from the ramp test to the 20 minute test. The first try gave me a 3% lower result (so the other way around, but have been riding MTB instead of TT, so I guess that’s partly the difference.
I just could not recover fully from theshold and over under workouts on my ramptest FTP, In most casess I could complete a build block (but not all) but only saw gains in the first build block (where I still had noob gains to get).
Anyway, what I’m trying to say is that it’s quite difficult stuff and even if your quite analytical about it, it will still take time to figure out what suits you personally. But to get the gains you work fork you have to experiment what’s best.
So in your case the ramp test is clearly not your test, and maybe the 20 minute test is still to “easy” for you. So try to keep track of how you feel after a block, after recovery and how you perform. keep track of this and try to find patterns.
Brian to sum this all up am I right in saying that for a T Trialist a 20 minute FTP test is better than the ramp test because it does not stress your vo2max capabilities which the ramp test exposes? Sorry to go over this but I am not really into data and a lot of it is over my head. Thanks for your help is there any other articles applicable to this that might help? Could you also send me the link to Stern articles. Thanks
It’s more stressful than a ramp test, I think similar mental stress to a 20 min test. The TSS would be higher than both since it’s 40-50 mins.
I’d simply say that if you are a time trialist then pacing isn’t an issue, and any sufficiently long test is a good test. As a TT’er you should already know how to pedal just above and below threshold, to ‘surf the wave’ so to speak, and then its simply a matter of determining a) just your threshold, or b) your threshold and time-to-exhaustion.
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I can give you my experience of the protocol… I made a ‘baseline’ test in the workout creator with 10 minutes at 93%, 15 minutes at FTP and then a gradual ramp of 1% every two minutes to exhaustion.
I estimated an FTP of 210 and it turned out to be 205. The test felt controlled and manageable until I got further above FTP and then it was fairly clear when I needed to stop. Only the last few minutes were really hard. There is zero need to pace and mentally it was pretty easy.
What was interesting was that analysing the test portion on Trainerroad afterwards using the sliders to capture the test portion of my ride showed that even if I had stopped two minutes earlier the resulting FTP would have been the same, because the final ramp is gradual. If I had stopped three minutes earlier I would have scored 1W less. Therefore no need to kill yourself for one more minute, the result won’t change much.
I like it! I’m looking forward to seeing how it tracks my fitness and whether I can progress to a longer test as I get fitter. I will also find a week sometime to do one and a TR ramp test in the same week to see how the results compare. I think both have a place.
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Thanks, will give it a try.
Thanks for the info you sent I will try it out on the road on the TT.
You mentioned the Coach Ric Stern in the UK how can I get a hold of these articles?
To improve my FTP is there one thing I should concentrate on to try to be more consistent?
Thanks again for you help much appreciated.
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Just had a good read of the article, enjoyed it, it is interesting it is only a guideline the ramp test but gives a rough estimate between 72% -77% ie 75% . No golden bullet for improvement I guess! Thanks again.
I prefer my estimates to come from doing the very thing I’m estimating - so give me an open road and 30-70 minutes and all’s good with the world!
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Cartman comment same as my experience. And people telling you to raise your ftp, unless you see their comments as being supportive, should be ignored
Hi, I am a 49 year-old woman and have been training and racing long course triathlons for the past 5 years. This September, I started the IM Full Distance program, and apart from a short hiatus due to an injury where I could bike but not run, I have completed 95% of the prescribed workouts at or above the prescribed power.
However, each time I complete the ramp test, I am surprised.
I was surprised in September to see my FTP drop to 184 from 210 earlier in the summer, but I was okay with that given that although I was very active during the summer, I had been mostly running and hiking, and only occasionally biking.
So, when I took the ramp test last week, after 12 weeks of diligent work on the trainer, I was hoping to see a big jump, at least 10 watts. However, to my dismay, I gained only 3 watts.
I have two thoughts about this:
-
Perhaps FTP gains are not made in the base phase as much as in other phases
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I need a longer warm up before attempting the ramp test.
I’m going to focus my efforts on the second point (since it’s within my power) and repeat the ramp test some day next week when I am feeling rested. Then, I’m going to do at least 30 minutes of low Zone 2 before starting the test. In the past, I have used the 20 minute FTP test, and that test not only has a longer warm up, but it has some intense efforts before going into the actual test. I think the combo of the longer warm up and the intense bursts will help to warm up this aging machine better.
I’ll report back!
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