I have tried both trainer road and Xert training plans over the last 2 years and I always see an initial bump in my FTP and I feel really strong for 3-4 months and then I fall off a cliff. No idea what’s going on but it equates to an FTP that floats between 240-260. I feel like I’m putting in a lot of time for little to no gain. Im 44 and 73kg and just started structured training in Jan of 2019. Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated.
career info…- TrainerRoad
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To share your profile, log into TR, go to Account on the left, then in your Profile look for the Account dropdown - and set it to Public. Then you can paste a link to your Career page if you want feedback on your training history.
^This.
I’m sure people will be able to give more advice if you can share your training history.
But if you are seeing a bump then ‘fall off a cliff’ that suggests a recovery issue, to me…
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I’m definitely curious what Xert is telling you. My xert always wants to lay a lot of low intensity volume on me
Just glancing at a few of the weeks it seems like a lot of .80+ intensity factor, some with multiple .9 to 1.0 i.f. rides.
If I had to guess, that’s fatigue catching up with you.
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I didn’t look at all of your rides, but like @therealemm said, it looks like none of your rides are easy. For instance, this last week you labelled a Tuesday ride as recovery, but the IF was .71. A true recovery ride should be way less than that. Check out the various versions of recess for a good recovery ride to spin the legs out.
Also, I think you may be too hard on yourself. On Sunday you set All-time power PRs from everything from 2-5 minutes, and then basically everything over an hour and 10 minutes.
Lastly, it seems like you are mixing and matching Trainerroad, Zwift, and Xert. Why not try sticking to one plan, and try following it religiously for 12 weeks or so?
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Xert is so hard to dial in… since there are no recovery rides or weeks built in you have to adjust that dumb slider bar on how you feel which determines your upcoming ride etc… Its a great premise but requires a lot of attention. also according to Xert you have to bang out a minimum of 10 hours a week to make any gains whatsoever…
+1 on don’t mix xert and Trainer Road. My experience with that was very bad. 
The two eco-systems are driven by entirely different models and the clash between the two will generate a lot of strange fatigue. I like the analytics of Xert but it also is very ad hoc user based input driven and tends toward ‘optimized’ outcomes based upon personal selectors. The two ftps don’t ever match, and as you said you have to manage your own fatigue against the “Pacer’s” recommendations.
During covid I can’t handle xert…so I’ve gone 100% trainer road, 6 hours a week of volume, a set plan I can stick to and not constantly fiddle with.
Ya that Sunday ride my PM had a low battery and the last 30 min or so are bogus numbers… Thanks though I had forgotten to flag that
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that’s not right… Id say 95% of my rides are indoors… I live downtown Chicago and rarely go outside… Maybe once a week during the summer
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so if I’m digging a hole for myself how long do I need to rest to get back to normal and start over? I took most of last week off and started today with mid vol SS base and the first workout was not east at all… I would have killed that workout 2 weeks ago…
Ya I totally agree with you there expect for the FTPs don’t ever match. Every ramp text I’ve taken matched almost exactly with what Xert was saying my FTP was at the time… Creepy close to within a watt or 2
Hmm. that is really weird on the ftp thing. It’s never the same for me. But generally the trainer road ramp tests haven’t been accurate to my real world ftp either. so. /shrug. Who knows why. Xert and real world ftp are as you say spookily accurate.
So for your new base block you did a ramp test, then went into the first ss ride and it was too hard at the ftp it selected for you? I don’t see your ramp test. what was the first ride it prescribed?
So I didnt do a ramp test and took the FTP that Xert was giving me… I know I know you’re going to say to do a ramp tex but like I said its been so close in my experience. Plus I feel like I have been digging myself out of a hole the last couple weeks so Im sure it will be low and then I will just make false gains in the next week or 2 and be stuck training at a much lower level… this whole thing is frustrating
First let me say I’m sorry. I’m sure it is frustrating. I don’t think pushing the training at the prior ftp is going to be effective, or at the very least it will be difficult to hit the targets straight away. Sweet spot base is no joke, I had a really hard time adjusting to it from what could only be called traditional base, and from a very xert based training model and a lot of ad hoc riding.
That said. I am curious what xert thinks of your fatigue level. Early on xert was showing me as VERY tired during the first weeks of sweet spot base mid. To give you context by the end of the first week Xert showed me as red, and I stayed there until the end of the first base block. (4 weeks). Second block I was red half the time, now in build I’m not in the red.
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I guess ill drop the FTP a bit or take a ramp test and start all over again and stick to TR and be consistent. Ill let you know what Xert says about my fatigue level but I don’t think it will be in the red. SS base mid vol is pretty low TSS compared to some of the weeks I’ve put in over the last few months, but maybe that’s exactly what I need 
thanks for the insight though and I appreciate your time
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SS base mid vol is pretty low TSS compared to some of the weeks I’ve put in over the last few months
Not all TSS is created equal. If you’re absolutely ruining yourself and riding 500TSS, it isn’t the same as having 500TSS with some lower power/recovery rides thrown in there to let your body recover from the more intense stuff.
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Sounds like you’re doing too much too fast, but I don’t believe what some say here about needing constant structure. My personal strategy is to stick to the prescribed plan 100%. I may modify some days or add Z2, but i don’t turn up the intensity no matter how good I feel. I don’t ride outside AT ALL during the plan (instead of, or in addition to the prescribed work), making sure to nail every interval inside and get the most benefit. A good strategy when outside in the warm months is to stagger weeks, so I’ll do a week of say 7 hours, then 8, then 9, then 10, and then I’ll take a “rest week” with like 6-7 hours of easier pace riding. This keeps you from getting too burned out and keeps me fresh all summer.
For the last 2 years I’ve spent November to March respectively only indoors doing a TR plan, then in Spring/Summer/Fall I basically ride outside however I want, though keep it mixed up, not making every ride super hard but not being complacent either. I’m also friends with riders of various skill levels so a bunch of my rides end up being easier as I hang out with the newer riders, and some end up super hard as I chase friends much faster than me. In between on rainy days I will either A. Free-ride Zwift or B. do random TR workouts. I just shoot for steady volume, minimum 6 hours a week, some weeks in the summer I push to 10-12. What’s the point? You gotta mix it up, and you CAN gain fitness wihle simply riding outdoors if you don’t ride too hard or too easy all the time.
My starting FTP back in the day (2017) was like 235, 1/1/19 I tested on TR at 268, ended that season in April and tested at 290w. Rode all last year, lot of big rides, centuries, tested 11/15/19 at 300w (10w gain from the spring/summer/fall outside). Ran the second year plan and finished 4/11/20 at 310w, then rode again all summer this year, set a bunch of PRs for myself, just tested at 316w yesterday.
Riding smarter, not necessarily harder, will be your friend.
I recommend trying something like this.
great advice!! thank you so much
Can you share your training history?