Here are the quick ones I found in the thread:
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Off the bat, I’m vegan although not as strict as some, I’ll typically have 1 day a week where I’ll ‘break’ it, usually just to be social - my Spanish in-laws are meat crazy.
So probably not a surprise that I enjoyed it, although obviously all the arguments for a vegan diet made in the film I’d already heard previously, usually in other docs (Forks over Knives, Cowspiracy etc). Interested though at looking into some of the criticism in terms of use of facts though, as most of it was really recycling some well known information and studies.
Big plus for me on his film though was highlighting the number of athletes benefiting from switching to plant-based from a range of sports, although it perhaps would have been good to hear from some of the more high profile ones e.g. Novak Djokovic and Messi (I suspect that they are likely not 100% plant-based, or at least not 100% of the time so perhaps don’t want to be labelled as such).
It’s obviously not going to convert everybody that watches it, but the positive is that it get a lot of people to watch a doc about veganism who probably would never have been interested before
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The word “benefit” is problematic IMHO: I have seen very little evidence that cutting out animal products completely is beneficial — for athletes or regular people. (Yes, eating more whole foods, fruits and vegetables is healthier, but that is different from cutting out animal products altogether.) Instead, I would have emphasized: you can be a top-level athlete on a plant-based diet.
Yeah that’s a fair comment mate. I think there are examples of people whose performance has improved, but this definitely more anecdotal than proven unfortunately. I read that Pete Attia article someone linked to and I liked what he said about nutritional consensus rarely converging (and a couple other good points).
Perhaps instead of trying to persuade people that you’ll be superhuman on a vegan diet, the first step is just to prove that it’s at least as good as a normal diet and then just as good as a ‘healthy’ meat/fruit/veg diet. Then throw in the benefits to the environment and obviously animal welfare and for me thats already a pretty compelling alternative.
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This documentary shows us that at a minimum, we can do just fine without animal products… and then goes on to provide anecdotes of people thriving on plant based diets.
We can get everything we need from plants, but yes you need variety and quantity to meet those nutrient goals. A variety of plant based foods will give you your essential amino acids. You do need to supplement B12 just like any carnivore does (I know some very fit riders who are big meat eaters and have come to me asking about B12 because their tests show that they are deficient, it’s not a vegan-only issue).
So I’d like to ask whether anybody can provide information as to why it is necessary to include animal products into my diet for either performance improvement or pure necessity?
The documentary doesn’t talk about (much) the global environmental issue or moral ethical issue of murdering 150 billion animals annually and the implications of that. But it just tries to make the point, at a bare minimum you do not need animal products, and I think that is an important message to share.
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When someone calls me a “murderer” for eating chicken with my salad, I tend to tune that person out.
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I think Attia’s point about improving one’s diet is really important: I don’t think you will improve much if you move from non-vegan junk food to vegan junk food. There is no “the” vegan diet, just like there is no “the” omnivore diet. In contrast, increasing the amount of whole foods and fruits and vegetables in your diet does have a solid scientific foundation. And it would apply to vegans, vegetarians and omnivores alike.
Anyone who started to seriously look into nutrition with an eye towards science knows what a mine field this is. And on a macro scale, these are important observations that have a good scientific foundation — they are just independent of whether or not you choose to eat animal products. As I understand the science, there is no single healthy diet, there are many healthy diets. Quantifying benefits of single diets is notoriously hard, and if the benefits are small, it is hard to impossible to attribute them to any one factor. So if you can boil it down to a few pithy and actionable pieces of advice, you could impact the lives of many. Eating more whole foods and less animal products is such a piece of advice.
Independently from that, I think it would be fair to say that you don’t need to eat animal products to perform at the highest level. And you could showcase examples. (Although, I would say Arnie is not the best example for a vegan athlete: during his Mr. Universe hey days, he certainly wasn’t on a vegan diet. But that’s a small point.)
Look at what people are expecting of a vegan diet, it shouldn’t just be one healthy way to live, but it should make you faster, stronger, last longer in bed and cure cancer at the same time. That’s a bit of a tall order. And IMHO when you make such claims (or at least strongly suggest it), you are putting hell of a burden on your shoulders. A vegan diet need not solve all the world’s problems 
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Haven’t watched it, but have heard it be slated as a throw away on a nutrition podcast I listen to! Well that, and all the netflix ones really…
If I was making my money off of high protein animal product cook books I would be slating it too… Unfortunately the science backs the benefits of cutting out that stuff.
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He didn’t slate it. It was a throw away about all the sensationalist movies. He relies on proven science, in my experience (and plenty of non-meat recipes in his books too).
Anyway, haven’t watched the film, am happy with the nutritionists I listen to listen and read all available science (Danny Lennon as well as Scott). So I’m out. I picked El Camino rather than this over the weekend!
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Are you seriously saying that buying fruit and vegetables is expensive? Try comparing it to the cost of meat. I am not talking about fake meat alternatives, these are not what this is about. It is damn cheap to make a meal out of vegetables. Whether you think it is difficult is another matter but personally find it easy.
That depends on where you live. Here in Japan, fruits and vegetables are expensive, I regularly pay more for vegetables than for fish. And I love fruit, so this really sucks for me — I love my fruits. Meat can also be pricey. Just to give you an idea, a single apple in a regular supermarket can cost $2.
No matter where you live, though, eating healthily is more expensive.
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Yeah point taken. In the UK it is easy and much cheaper/healthier to buy vegetables/fruit.
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I have yet to see one study posted that specifically says meat should be cut out for health reasons.
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Just two I looked up quickly from nutritionfacts.org to do with meat and diabetes:
nutritionfacts .org/video/meat-consumption-and-the-development-of-type-1-diabetes/
nutritionfacts .org/video/why-is-meat-a-risk-factor-for-diabetes/
The point I want to raise is, that although you can find nutritional value in meat, it comes with a host of further bad stuff, like how it correlates to diabetes, cancer, heart disease etc. If you consume animal products you are placing yourself at a higher risk than someone who doesn’t. Therefore why wouldn’t you get the nutrients from a healthier source?
Are there any nutrients that you can’t get from plant based?
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Studies meaning something very detailed I can read, not videos from a biased website/person with a doctorate.
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OK, on those links, click on the sources cited to see the detailed studies.
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You haven’t been looking very hard then. Here is an extract from this freely available publication: Effect of Red, Processed, and White Meat Consumption on the Risk of Gastric Cancer: An Overall and Dose–Response Meta-Analysis - PMC
There have been various studies to identify the underlying biological mechanism for the association between red and processed meat consumption and gastric cancer. Among gastric cancer risk factors, heme iron, which is abundantly contained in red meat promotes endogenous formation of carcinogenic N-nitroso compounds (NOCs) [63]. Since NOCs affect the high degree of nitrogenous remnants in the gastrointestinal tract, which contributes to formation of DNA adducts, they are considered as risk factors of gastric cancer, especially non-cardia gastric cancer
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Maybe some people eat meat not because they need to but because they want to, which is their choice. Beer also provides no performance benefit but plenty of us athletes drink it anyway.
And I feel bad for the animals too, but “murdering” is a bit of a stretch
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