FTP v Recent Hour PB

Training
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Apologies if covered elsewhere (I’ve had a quick search and couldn’t find anything)

Has any analysis been done on TrainerRoad users current FTP versus current season 1 hour PB.

Understand that the FTP is sometime referenced as hour power, but personally I’m only able to get to 85% of current FTP as my current season hour Personal Record.

I’m guessing longer intervals 20-30 mins are likely to help me close the gap, but wondered where other riders are. Guessing time triallists and Triathletes are likely approaching parity?

Thanks

Steve

2

There is lots of debate on this topic. The choice of 60 mins for FTP is arbitrary. It is supposed to represent MLSS (Maximal Lactate Steady State) and this might be something you can hold for 30 mins to 75 mins for different people. So because you can’t hold your FTP for an hour doesn’t mean that you can’t use it for training zones and so on.

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3

And here you will find more information about your question: Kolie Moore's FTP test protocol and I am recommending empiricalcycling podcast and episode about FTP.

Overall - your FTP usually sits between 30 min and 75 min (depends how trained you are and how aerobic inclined) or some coaches use 60 min power as reference for workouts (Seiler).

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I’ve held 91% for the first hour of a 1h45min climb. Finished at 88% overall. 293 ftp via ramp within a week or two.

Not a maximum effort as I was enjoying some scenery (great early morning mountain road) and also leaving something in reserve because I didn’t want to blow up near the top and get passed by my friend who usually is a tad faster than me.

After that I felt that I’d probably be able to do an all out effort at ftp for at least the bottom end of the ftp durations mentioned above.

However, I’ve never tried for a PB 1 hr power. Honestly, 90% of my riding is indoor with TR so I’ve never done a TT and I don’t race (thinking about it for some fun). And when I’m outside, I typically ride rolling hills that have 3-5 min climbs as I’m in a coastal region with many ridges/short slopes.

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Hi Steve, yes FFT collected data on a large group of TR users public data on their FTP tests (8x2;20m;60m) and their recent PRs at most times from 1min thru to 2 hours including 60min (so comparisons are possible). However our data is a still a tiny sample of the huge dataset that TR themselves have on file. bw alex

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FWIW I have achieved my FTP, which is tested regularly, on several 25 mile TT races.
I doubt I could sit on the turbo and do it though because of the mental challenge. The other variable is how much outside and inside FTP differ. Mine is teh same indoors on my road and TT bike and I do not think it is that much different outside but it is harder to tell than indoors.

If you are a Zwift user then you could try holding your FTP up Alpe De Zwift - even create a workout at FTP for the ride. Good luck with that.

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And? Have you done any analysis on it and gotten some sort of results? Sounds like it has the potential to be interesting.

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In my experiance I am much more likely to hit my FTP for Normalized power over a 1 hour crit than in a 1 hour steady state interval.

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Thanks John, funny enough it was an ascent of Alpe Du Zwift which gave me the 1 Hr PB when the ride was synced into TrainerRoad. I think I probably had another 2-3% in me, but was pretty spent by the time I got to the top. I definitely would have failed if I’d set out at FTP which is what prompted the original question. I’m only level 10 on Zwift currently (most workouts are on TR, but I like Zwift for the 90min+ efforts). As such I can only access Alpe du Zwift as part of a group ride and therefore the workout option is not really feasible. Once I get level 12 I’ll do what you suggest but set target watts at an increasing percentage of FTP and do it over once a week until I hit my failure point. No real relevance to it, but sustainable efforts at 1hr + are relevant to my goals so want to push myself in that direction

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Normally the way to do this is do it at FTP split the hour into sections with rests and slowly reduce the rests. Rather than slowly building up the power. 6x10 4x15 3x20 2x30 etc.

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11

yes, it is very interesting, basically simple assumptions on 95% rule (20minFTP test) and 90% rule (8x2test) are off by a fair margin. FTP60 seems pretty close to season’s best 60min CP PR but there are outliers. You can use the 1,2,5,10,20,30,60,90,120min PR to construct a pretty nice power curve calculator like this: FFT Magic Power-Duration Curve (FTP) Predictor [Link: fft.tips/curve] - Google Sheets

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Your “calculator” was pretty far off (7%) extrapolating my FTP from both 20min and 60min best efforts (I’ve done both tests this month).

‘Magic’ is an adequate descriptor.

I’ll stick with TR’s Ramp test and Empirical Cycling’s TTE/FTP test to provide reliable numbers at different stages throughout the season.

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Alex,

Do you think it is because the seasons best 60 correlates better with MLSS than the other ways of determining FTP?

or do you think it’s because of a relative dearth of 60 min efforts that are truly max?