We recently had a request to analyze an athlete that was doing a good job, and Alfred is doing a darn good job!
Was fun to dig into this account with Nate. There’s always room for improvement for all of us, and in Alfred’s case, we had lots to discuss about the lack of Threshold workouts, the goal of VO2 Max workouts and how to execute them, and more.
If you want your account to be analyzed, leave a comment on this video on YouTube!
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(00:00) Welcome!
(04:14) Training Insights and Strategies
(05:54) Crazy Zwift Club Stats!
(09:33) Why Hasn’t His FTP Gone Up??
(11:55) FTP Testing Methods and Insights
(29:57) Understanding FTP and CTL
(31:16) How Alfred got a higher FTP with lower volume
(33:53) Post-Workout Surveys and Their Benefits
(35:12) Master’s Plan and Key Workouts
(38:16) VO2 Max Workout Problems
(42:00) Avoiding Common Training Mistakes
(58:04) Consistency and Carbs: Keys to Success
Junior from Florida here! I had Mono followed up by the Flu for January and most of February and my FTP is down to 262 from 286 back in December, and after getting back to training I made a resolution to stick to more structured training. I would love it if you had any tips for me to gain that fitness back, and improve my training. Feel free to analyze my training calendar as well! I would appreciate any tips you would have to help me be more productive with my training! Thanks!
you are overestimating how consistently you’ve adhered to the plan(s)
you’ve reached your genetic potential
TR plans don’t work
There is some sort of bug in the software/your account
Regarding points 2 and 3 – unless you’ve been consistently training for many years point 2 is unlikely and considering the many success stories based around TR and their plans point 3 is probably also unlikely.
99% of the time these queries pop up, the answer is resoundingly point 1.
If I were you, I would take a very scrutinous look at my calendar over the last year and be brutally honest with myself regarding my consistency and adherence to the plan(s). Did I take any long breaks? Did I skip workouts more regularly than maybe once a month at most? Was I doing a bunch of unstructured riding/volume? Did I answer all the post workout surveys as accurately as possible? Was I taking recovery weeks seriously?
Most likely, if you’re honest with yourself some combination of the above factors is hindering your progress. If you have been super consistent following the plans, taking recovery weeks seriously, answering the survey questions accurately etc. then you should reach out to TR support because something might be wrong with the system and it doesn’t make sense for your FTP to stay stagnant if you’ve actually been doing the work.
I feel like I’ve adhered to the plan. I’m not too worried because while my FTP has stayed within 4 points over the last year, my “durability” on the bike is much better. It’s just strange to me that my FTP hasn’t moved.
I really enjoy these reviews of people’s careers, it helps emphasize what I need to be doing to get faster.
Ive been back on the bike for 4 weeks after being 100% focused on running for a year, I saw a nice ftp bump from the ramp test after 3 weeks of training and some recovery (222-240). I ran AI ftp after listening to this podcast and it put me at 251. I have accepted that, now we’ll see if I can do the work.
I’m back to TR after a few years of being out of the bike, but being focused on running and weightlifting.
I’d say that I’m a better runner than cyclist haha
Now my question is, does run activities affect FTP detection?
AI set my FTP at 264 (33m, 65kg, 172cm). I’m not sure if that’s accurate or if it was affected by running activities. It has happened to me before with other AI apps.
Have been using TR for over 10 years. On and off with structured plans, but its always been my only trainer workout platform. I had ACL reconstruction a year ago and have been working my way back with lots of marathon mtb races on the calendar this year. just completed an 8 week raise FTP plan. I was pretty consistent and respected red and yellow days well. It’s hard not to go long on the weekends, but when you do 8 hour races time in the saddle is sometimes the only way to get the mental conditioning in. Any way, just ran AI FTP detection and after 8 weeks i went from 287 to a whopping 288. Pretty disappointed as I felt like i was getting stronger despite accumulated fatigue towards the end. I also coach HS mtb and i never know what my TSS will be like riding with the kids. Was really hoping to get back above 4 w/kg for the first time in a while. Whatever…just created another 3 month program LOL
Really enjoyed this episode and like that you’ve begun to include “screen shots”. I’d still like to see some lunch and learns though.
Regarding FTP increase and AI detection. When should we accept AI detection, every time? I ask because I know once you “accept” and assuming FTP goes up (fingers crossed), the level of the workouts goes down (right?). So, is it better to let the workout levels go up at lower FTP or accept FTP and let the values go up. Maybe no difference. I ask in the context of something like threshold workouts and sweet spot. At lower “levels” aren’t they shorter durations or maybe this is just a result of where I am in my training cycles.
Level up or power up and when, that’s the question.
[Asking for a friend, Luigi…)
I wonder if it would be possible to have some sort of weekly Plan Compliance score that weights the most important aspects of a week IE “you have achieved 50% of the plan this week” I know this could be confronting but it is what a coach would be telling you.
+1. Always nice to get a look into what other people are doing. We used to have an annual “coaches Round Table” where coaches would bring their training plan for the season and a “coaching nugget” to discuss. So much learning can come from others. This kinda reminds me of those!
On that note it would be nice to see the person who’s training is getting reviewed to provide some background and a little detail. We all have different goals, schedules, training history, etc. Someone who is a firefighter that works 48 hour shifts might appear to have inconsistent training (which we wouldn’t know unless they tell us). Or someone who works a desk job might prefer a 30-60 minute recovery effort over a complete day off because they sit all day. A rationale of why you do what you do could not only provide insight but take out the guess work and spur on more conversation.
On the episode above, they mention that contrary to common belief tests like the ramp and 20m ftp tend to under estimate FTP since it’s just really mentally hard. e.g. people mentally bail before their physical limit is reached.
So, you could do a ramp or 20m test and see what you get. If it’s more, and not less, it might be an indication that something’s off with the AI estimate.
Gonna try to quick-fire respond to a few of these questions:
@Dono Sorry to hear about the illnesses! I hope you’re recovering well and feeling healthier again. I think once you’re feeling back to 100%, your fitness will come back in no time. It looks like you’re already good with consistency when you’re not sick, which is awesome! If your resolution is to do more structured training this season, try to apply that consistency to your structured workouts as well – even just a couple of structured workouts in addition to mostly unstructured riding can make a huge difference. Just remember to cap your “hard” days to 2-3x per week so you don’t pile on too much fatigue.
@ddetch The biggest thing that sticks out to me is that you seem to travel a lot, which results in quite a bit of time off. It looks like you’ll have stretches of solid consistency, but they get interrupted every several weeks by 1-2 weeks of travel. That’s most likely to be the reason your FTP hasn’t gone up – but it’s still good to hear your durability is improving! It can be tough to schedule training around frequent travel, but if you’re able to figure out some solutions/compromises around that, I think you’d start to see your FTP bump up as well.
@striderkeni Runs do not affect AI FTP Detection. How does your current FTP feel? If workouts feel appropriately challenging, you’re probably on the right track!
@dadavida Nice work getting back at it after your ACL reconstruction! Remember that it takes time and consistency to raise your FTP, and 8 weeks isn’t a lot of time in the grand scheme of endurance training. If you stick with that upcoming 3-month program, I think you’ll keep on getting faster!
@grega Generally speaking, we recommend using AI FTP Detection “more” during the Base and Build Phases, and “less” (or not at all) during the Specialty Phase. You’re correct that an increase in FTP results in a decrease in Progression Levels, so during the Specialty Phase, we tend to advise athletes to work on strengthening their PLs to really “sharpen” the specific fitness they’ll need for their goal event(s). Other athletes prefer to focus on periods of training where they’ll prioritize PLs over FTP or vice versa… So it ultimately depends on your own goals, where you are in your training cycle, and how close to your goal event(s) you are.
First, great installment! Pretty much confirmed my suspicions about my own experiences.
I found the FTP bell curve discussion at about 10:00 to be intriguing, as I fall into those same categories – assuming “everyone” else is over 300, and my own at currently 224. My “success story” is not a rapid one, but my initial ramp test was 139 as I recall. The next one was 176 and I chalked the increase up mostly to not knowing how to take a ramp test the first time. Have to say, I was thrilled to break into the 200s, and have seen firsthand how consistency or the lack thereof can impact FTP progression. I am a believer, although I sometimes find it difficult to manage due to multiple “real life” challenges.
All that said, at 10:06, Jonathan said there would be a link to the W kg calculator where we can see how we stack up against other TR athletes, but for the life of me I don’t see that link. Would love to see that comparison if someone could direct me.
Thanks for the help, and for what I feel like is a great product/program.
https://trainerroad.cc/trzwiftclub
