Ramp Test - Kickr - How to incorporate second spindown

Equipment
1

Many people recommend doing a second spin down on Kickr’s after 10-15 minutes of warm up. How/when are some of you incorporating the second spindown into the ramp test?

2

Precisely which Kickr do you have?

  • A wheel-on Kickr Snap should be calibrated as you suggest, each and every workout (per the manufacturer, to get best results).

  • A wheel-off Kickr only needs to be calibrated when a bike is installed, the trainer is moved, or about once every couple of weeks if it stays in place with the bike installed.

    • As such, if you have this trainer, I recommend a calibration at the end of a workout, the day before the Ramp test. That way it is fully warmed up and will hold that calibration for the test the following day.
3

For my Kickr Snap (wheel on) I perform a Spin Down calibration every ride. I use the +10 min warm up (because I’m old and I also need more warm up) then calibrate. I also check the tire pressure every ride/workout as well because I’m OCD. Anyways, after 10 mins of riding, in a TrainerRoad workout, click the “paired button”, usually lower right corner, and select your Kickr. Once in the “Device Settings” for your Kickr you’ll see the “Calibrate” button. Click that and you will pedal up to 24 mph, which will require you to shift. Once you hit 24 mph it will tell you to stop pedaling (don’t move pedals forward or backwards) and allow the spin down to happen. Your’re done. Remember to go back to your original gearing after the spin down.

4

Curious to what the standard deviation may be when you do not calibrate every ride. I do mine once a week.

5

I believe my is a 2017 V2 Kickr. I spindown at the start of every ride but based on reading various articles/post here and elsewhere, I have been doing a second spin down 10-15 minutes in on each workout. If that would interfere with the first interval, then I have been extending the warm up accordingly to get the second spin down in prior to the first interval.

6

Per Wahoo:

HOW AND WHEN TO DO A KICKR SPINDOWN / CALIBRATION

  • To calibrate your KICKR for the most accurate readings, you’ll need to perform a spindown using the Wahoo Fitness app for iOS or Android. Though some 3rd party apps also support spindowns (like Zwift), the Wahoo Fitness app should be used exclusively for the best and most consistent experience. A spindown is recommended every 2 weeks or after transporting to a new location.

So, you don’t need to be doing it with your current, Kickr 17 (actually V3) trainer any more than I suggested above. You can save a fair bit of time if you leave it all setup.

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7

I struggle with this as always have to move my trainer to put it away. Think next time I’ll put it in position in the morning do a 10 minute warm up, spindown and then do the ramp test in the afternoon.

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8

I’ve got a kickr core, I don’t do a second spindown, I do a single spindown after 8-10 minutes riding. In most workouts there are a few warm up intervals then a break at about that point, so I just do a single spindown then. Originally I was just doing it every few weeks, but Nate recommended in one of the podcasts to do it every ride after warming up (presumably based on what they’d seen in their testing).

My kickr tends to mostly stay in place, but my and my wife’s bikes get swapped on and off. In practise I’m finding that the calibration values don’t change day to day as wahoo say, but a spindown is so quick that I’ll probably keep just doing them.

Now, onto the ramp test specifically. It is only flat for 5 minutes before the ramp starts, I’ll extend warmup by a few minutes, do a spindown after 7 or 8, then into the ramp.

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9

That was one of the primary sources for the post warm up spin down as well - hearing Nate’s comments. But he is not alone, I have heard this multiple times from various sources. I just do the initial one out of habit, but suppose it’s unnecessary.

Just trying to figure out why so many recommend a post warm up spin down (knowing Kickr says otherwise). I give what the TR folks say a lot of weight because they have more data than anyone on these things.

10

One thing that I know causes problems is the silly naming that Wahoo chose for their trainers. Specifically calling the Snap the “Kickr Snap”. So many people call their trainer a “Kickr” regardless of it being the “real Kickr” (wheel-off) or the Snap (wheel-on).

That difference MATTERS A LOT, as Wahoo and CycleOps in particular, say that the intended calibration frequency between the wheel-on/off trainers is different. It leads to plenty of confusion, and I think the comments on the podcast assist in that confusion.

Wahoo:

  • Snap
  • If this is your first time using the KICKR SNAP, you may be prompted to perform a Factory (or Advanced) Spindown, which is required for accurate calibration and performance.
  • Kickr
  • To calibrate your KICKR for the most accurate readings, you’ll need to perform a spindown using the Wahoo Fitness app for iOS or Android. Though some 3rd party apps also support spindowns (like Zwift), the Wahoo Fitness app should be used exclusively for the best and most consistent experience.
    • A spindown is recommended every 2 weeks or after transporting to a new location.

CycleOps:

  • Hammer & Magnus
  • The recommended calibration timing depends on which smart trainer you own.
    • If you have a Hammer (wheel-off), a monthly calibration is all you need.
    • If you own a Magnus (wheel-on), we recommend that you calibrate before each ride to ensure you’re receiving the very best data.
    • We also recommend calibrating after any firmware updates.

Cold vs Hot:

1 Like
11

I believe Chad and the guys (I think it was mostly Chad) advocated calibrating any trainer on every ride after a 10-15 min warm-up on one of the podcasts.

12

I’d like to hear that in context. I think it is entirely unnecessary based on mfg recommendations and my own experience (cross checked wit P1 pedals nearly every ride).

I am 3 weeks without a calibration on my H2 and it matches within single digit watts bottom to 400w.

13

I rarely calibrate my Snap. I’m pretty sure Nate mentioned in one or two of the podcasts that if you’re using a PM to record the power, then calibration wasn’t needed every workout. Might be wrong about that. I make sure the tire pressure is the same every workout along with the exact same number of turns on the resistance knob.

14

From Wahoo regarding Snap:

For best results, be sure to follow these guidelines:

  • Always remember to stop pedaling completely after reaching the target speed
  • Ensure the roller adjustment knob is turned 2 complete (360º) rotations once it contacts the tire
  • Check tire pressure before each ride to match the pressure recommended on the tire sidewall
  • Perform a warmup and spindown before every ride
  • Always use a slick (non-knobby) tire with the KICKR SNAP as knobs generate excessive noise and vibration
  • Use tires with a hard compound or a dedicated trainer tire to decrease wear and extend tread life
  • Tighten the roller one quarter turn (90º) if your tire consistently slips when pedaling
15

Does anyone know how power match impacts all of this? If the resistance is being determined by the power reported by the power meter then does this make the spindown less important?

I tend to just do a spindown once a week at the end of a workout (if the bike hasn’t come off of the kickr core). If I’ve removed the bike, moved the trainer etc then I will do an extended warm-up before the workout to get the system warm then do a spindown

16
17

In one of the podcasts, Nate had emailed Wahoo about this. they recommended a calibration EVERY ride. I know on their website and marketing blurb they say every couple of weeks and I know mine is pretty accurate. But i think this is also to compete with the NEO that never needs calibrating. i also put this to the test by comparing my power from the Kickr (uncalibrated for 2 weeks) to my Vector 3s (calibrated.) When both calibrated at the start of the two weeks they match almost perfectly. When the Kickr isn’t calibrated I noticed some significant differences - generally throughout the ride and some weird little outages that were well out.This got worse over the 2 weeks Following the advice in the podcast I now do mine every ride. if nothing else it should make my power consistent for every workout.

3 Likes
18

Thanks for the clarification! I knew I had heard it in a podcast, but was having a difficult time remembering the context.

19

For those of you with Kickr doing second spindown during workout, do you use TR or Wahoo app for spindown?

(My current setup is Kickr18 - Ant+ - Mac/TR fwiw)