I am new to indoor training and have been using TR and following TR recomended workout plan for the past 2 weeks. I’ve done 10 planned/TR-recommended workouts to date and like the workout and my progress.
I can normally do 1 - 1:15 hour workouts@Endurance (70-110 Watts) level @90 rpm cadence with low/moderate effort. My TR-Start-RampTest FTP was 133, got adjusted to 138 and got bumped to 142 yesterday when I did TR Threshold (There Sisters -1). My HR was normal @130 with a maximum of 150. So, although I was tired, I was not drowsy nor dead :-). In fact, 2 hours later I went for a movie and dinner.
While doing TR Threshold (There Sisters -1) yesterday, I stopped for 1-2 minutes – twice for water and the 3rd time because I did not want to push myself too much (although I could have). When I restarted after these breaks I was able to perform much better and perhaps with lesser relative effort. Perhaps it was the rest, or the water or the motivation to complete.
Question:
Is it okay to take a few short breaks – 2 to 3 breaks each approximately 1-2 minutes in a 1:15 hour workout – to drink water or catch my breath when doing Threshold & VO2 Max?
I am asking this question because I like TR and wish to use it to develop myself to my very best in the long run. However, I don’t want to break prescribed TR workout (methodology) recommendations NOR push myself to the very limit. Hence need some good & concrete advice beyond saying – “it depends.”
I’d say it mostly depends on the workout design. For Three Sisters -1 ideally you would use the two six minute recovery valley’s to recover and get that drink in. I typically don’t even try to drink during the intervals and just load up during the recovery sections.
That workout also has two 12 minute endurance blocks built into it before and after the Threshold sections, For those ideally you should be able to drink during the interval as needed without stopping, but if you feel you need to stop during those sections it’s not a big deal.
yeah, it’s fine. Nobody is going to tell you off and the App isn’t going to suddenly flash up on the screen that “you’ve done it all wrong!!”. Do what you need to do.
Over time you might find that you don’t need the extra breaks anymore.
When you say “interval” does it mean the time of peak performance at/near/above FTP and like wise when you say “recovery” does it mean the trough between the intervals of peak performance (when you ride relatively easier)?
Am asking as I took all my water breaks in the “troughs” … mostly in middle of the “troughs” so that I could extend my burn, then drink water and then pick up cadence/power/momentum for the peak stretches once again. BTW, I did not take any break during the initial and final recovery/endurance blocks.
So, for Three Sisters -1 the intervals are the 3x9 minutes over/under blocks. They would essentially be the main focus of that workout. Ideally you would want to get through those sections without stopping. Most would say if you have to stop during those sections then the workout is too hard for you as ideally you want to get through those 3x9 sections as prescribed. That said since you are new to this it’s not a huge thing at all. If you’re using the adaptive training feature TR will learn from your performance in these rides and will adjust your workouts in the future.
The endurance sections before and after are to build in a little fatigue before the intervals and then allow you to put in more work at a lower intensity after the threshold intervals.
Its not a big deal, generally, to take short breaks. If a minute or two of rest makes the difference between crushing the next interval or struggling, I would say take the break. This is to be taken within reason. A couple minutes is fine. If you need a 10+ minute break, there’s probably something else going on (wrong FTP, training fatigue etc.)
Thanks for the very practical tip … especially as I am new to TR and in fact have been biking for only 2 years.
My breaks are mostly 1 - 1 1/2 minutes – for water, decompress a bit when I am between 2 intense intervals and at much lower power of ~ 100 Watts. It is never a 10 minutes TR vacation
In between 20 min and 60 min there are two 6 min recovery sections in between the 9 min intervals. Stopping during those 6 min sections is no problem at all. Those sections are designed to get you fully recovered so you can be ready to do the next 9 min interval. If you need an extra minute or two in there go for it.
For future workouts use the workout survey after the workout and it’ll adjust your workouts. If you are having to stop during those 9 min intervals because it’s too hard I would be marking it “very hard” or “all out” so it knows to adjust future workouts. If you are stoping during the endurance or recovery sections I wouldn’t worry about it and just tell it your overall feeling of the workout.
It’s probably NBD, but I try to complete the workouts as designed, which for me means no breaks. Drinking on the go while pedaling is easy if using a cycling bidon. Most workouts are pretty short anyway, 1.5hrs and under.
trainer road has a weird habit of making the rest intervals quite short, something you really never see when people are training outside with lots of time on their hands. So if I were you I would try to keep the resting for during the rest intervals and try to be aware of what workouts are scheduled and look for workout alternatives of similar level with longer rest intervals.
The question for me is how are you rating these workouts in the post-workout survey. Stopping for a minute during a recovery interval to refill a bottle or use the bathroom is okay, but you shouldn’t need to stop three times in a relatively short, low PL workout like Three Sisters -1, especially to catch your breath, which makes me think this workout is too hard for you. I’d probably be rating that workout at least “very hard,” and if I couldn’t have completed the workout without the breaks, I’d rate it “all out” so TR adjusts accordingly.
My assumption is that this is intentional and part of the intended training stress. When I do workouts outdoors, I try to stick the schedule as closely as reasonable considering the vagaries of riding outside. .
Thank you SO VERY MUCH with your detailed and clarifying responses. Appreciate it VERY MUCH.
My 2 breaks were in the 6 min sections and your comment – “Stopping during those 6 min sections is no problem at all. Those sections are designed to get you fully recovered so you can be ready to do the next 9 min interval” – is the confirmation I was seeking.
I’ve never stopped in the hard intervals (because I thought that it would defeat the purpose; besides, it is silly to stop and start when I am in my “peak zone” at full/max cadence and power.
Yesterday was the FIRST time that I ever took a break/stop in any of my 10 workout effors – including Initial Ramp Test, Auburn (Theshold), Mound (VO2 Max), Moose Tooth 2 (Threshold), and Pope (VO2 Max). Hence the reason I was looking for advice because I did not want to make it a habit … especially if it is bad and addictive.
I try my best to go as far as I can; however, I’ve still not perfected the art of whiping up my water bottle from the cage and taking a sip. Guess I should practice that too … another learning activity with TR (sounds like a commercial )
I’ve taken 20 to 30 seconds off and the change is amazing. I feel like I can handle the next interval better, but taking minute or more off, to me, seems longish, but you do you. There are some people who will say any break is a failure, and I can see that, but I feel I get better doing the hard work and finishing the routine, and if it take a few small breaks to get there, it’s still productive. Would I like to kill it and not need a break(s), sure, but I still finished it, so that should count for something. For the ones that I just can’t even with breaks, I bail and try them again another time. People that get into slamming others for taking short breaks seem to be going the ‘it doesn’t matter because it’s indoors’ and that’s not really constructive criticism as who rides a whole long brutal ride pedaling 100% of the time and not coasting or having to stop for road crossing, etc.
I did do one TR workout that I just felt like I couldn’t finish it and came back a week or so later, after doing what I thought was buildup for it, and did finish it. It felt good, and I was glad I killed it, but wow, took a lot to get it done…
Just saw your response: You sound fine. Don’t worry about it. I’ve seen people I’ve followed doing Peloton and other workouts and stopping repeatedly and for larger spans of time. At that point, bailing and going on smaller workouts to build up to that one seems a great idea.
Thanks for your constructive and detailed comments with concrete recommendations.
I believe I can shorten my breaks to 20-30 seconds … just to get a sip or adjust my shorts . But as shawrx suggested, I should learn to whip up my water-bottle and still keep pedaling along along (with perhaps a slight drop in cadence). Guess this is the right thing to do.
Indoor biking may be the right time for me to practice that skill too (as TR seems to track everything I do
I believe I could have gone the full “Three Sister -1” ride without a break … just as I did with Pope, and others at Threshold/VO2 max level. Yesterday with “Three Sisters -1” was the first time I took a break all in the (intra-peak) recovery zone (i.e., in the 6 minutes stretches). That was precisely why I asked the question since it was the first time I took 2.5 breaks (in the troughs/recovery zones).
I suppose you are a very advanced rider @300+ FTP. I am a long way from that. All that wish to achieve/do is 1) improve with TR 2) do well on the road 3) continue to improve with TR during summer 4) improve my physicality 5) not give up TR nor biking in the long haul
What I’ve noticed is that TR’s recoomendatins are pretty-much on the money and consistent with my commitment, progress and performance. That is one reason that I subscribed to TR as it makes dynamic adjustments (up or down) and has long term plans for me that are consistent with my objectives and in keeping with my progress.
My point is for a threshold workout with a PL of 3.3, you shouldn’t need to take multiple breaks, regardless of your FTP (workouts are scaled to your FTP, so my FTP is irrelevant). What I’m saying is that a) there’s a difference between taking a break because you have to hit the head or refill a bottle and taking a break because you need to catch your breath, and b) you have to answer the post-workout survey accordingly so that TR can adapt the workouts properly. If, for example, you needed to take several breaks to catch your breath during a workout and then answered “easy” on the survey, then TR will adapt your workouts to make them harder and then you’d start having trouble completing those without taking more breaks. I’ve made that mistake in the past and it just turned into a vicious circle that derailed my progress.
TLDR: It’s fine to take the breaks, just be honest with yourself about why you’re taking them and fill out the survey accordingly.
People always seem to forget that TR has always been focused on “time crunched” athletes, so typically people with 3-10 hours available per week. So, yeah if you dont have 20 hours available to grind out z2 rides, your workouts will be shorter, more intense, with fewer breaks.
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