Thinking about a $2/month price raise

[Nate_Pearson]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. We’re going to move forward with this. We’ll send out notices over the new few days in batches.

[berto2cj]

There is something to be explored of in-app or other add ons. Besides the obvious pay for watts, I’d pay a few for a human review….

I wonder what else could be a spot buy

[berto2cj]

Thanks for updates.

[berto2cj]

Missed hammerhead, wahoo, and Apple Watch

[bfrostieone]

That’s totally fair, thanks for the response.

[jgood10332]

Price is what you pay for something. Value is what you get out of it. I think this is a fair increase. I get great value from TR. Period.

[Ivan_BG]

Go ahead! Thanks for asking! You can increase another $2 in June 2029 if you want!

[r-squared]

Having an advertisement-free podcast is a HUGE part of that value for me. The podcast itself is very well done - - quality product/service.

[jtuk]

Not sure if it’s been mentioned previously and looks like the changes are going to happen anyway but have you ever considered a tiered membership? I only use Trainerroad as something to control the trainer. None of the mentioned features have added any real value for me personally in the last 5 years. I’ve looked at the new features as they’ve been released but it’s just not what I want/need from the software and I don’t see anything coming that would change that.

I’d be interested in a basic legacy plan that gives access to a basic workout library or even just workout creator alongside the calendar with none of the extras. I’ve always held on to legacy pricing for this reason but sounds like that might be coming to an end and I could probably achieve the same functionality I require with my Garmin head unit for free.

[ivegotabike]

Is legacy pricing still going to be a thing for those of us that have been around long enough to have it?

[trpnhntr]

@Nate_Pearson

We’re going to do the same opt-out with athletes that have legacy pricing that we did last year. We hope that the combination of inflation + new features is enough to persuade those people, but they will be able to opt-out and choose their legacy price or a 15% continual discount. *We’re not going to do this part.

Those with legacy pricing who chose a 15% discount last time would be priced at $18.69 (or the yearly 15% discount equivalent).

Given this strike through I think a more thorough walkthrough of the various options and impact on the various legacy pricing tiers is in order to answer this question

@ivegotabike

Is legacy pricing still going to be a thing for those of us that have been around long enough to have it?

[abrooks13]

I mentioned exactly that further up but I don’t see it happening. Looking at alternatives at the moment but no rush as it’s the summer here.

[Nate_Pearson]

@ivegotabike

Is legacy pricing still going to be a thing for those of us that have been around long enough to have it?

Yes, we aren’t touching that.

[edistoed]

My opinion:

1. I love you guys and love the community you’ve built.

2. I had to ditch my subscription a while back - too many products competing for my limited subscription budget. My rationale was to focus on services that are centered around riding outside, and not the trainer. As I’ve aged into the Masters category, TrainerRoad was just too much training load, and I LOATHE riding inside now. I no longer need, nor desire, getting faster or adding watts to my legs - I’m happy just surviving to enjoy cycling!

3. I do believe your price increase is likely fair based on the value you provide, and all the added features since the last increase. If I were in a different spot in my cycling, I wouldn’t have an issue with it.

I guess an option would be to do tiered pricing for various features, but frankly, that’s a business practice that kind of disgusts me in most every instance.

That being said - once they fix aging and/or have that magic pill that makes me feel like I can handle training load better at my age, I’ll be back!

[SarahLaverty]

@edistoed

I love you guys and love the community you’ve built.

@edistoed

That being said - once they fix aging and/or have that magic pill that makes me feel like I can handle training load better at my age, I’ll be back!

“Surviving to enjoy cycling” is great if you don’t have a desire to get faster anymore .

Buuut forget a pill! Sounds like you just needed a Master’s Training Plan? We designed these new Training Plan’s for athletes wanting additional recovery in their training.

@edistoed

I LOATHE riding inside now.

You can do all of your Training Outside now that we have AI FTP detection! .

So just in case you’re interested in getting faster again, I’ll leave information about these new features here :

What are Masters Plans?

How to Use AI FTP Detection

[edistoed]

@SarahLaverty

So just in case you’re interested in getting faster again, I’ll leave information about these new features here :

Thank you @SarahLaverty . I am aware of, and have utilized both the items you listed (Master’s plans and AI FTP), I don’t need a marketing pitch, just providing my opinion as asked for in the OP.

[Mindflash]

I do feel it’s a fair increase while wondering at the same time how much and for how long I am paying for WL2.0 development already.

There are other ways to increase revene and TR is not touching them at all.
Why not offering optiom podcast channel membership with keeping all content free?
And merch… I would proudly wear TR kit. I struggle to understand why TR is against it.

[OreoCookie]

@gcarver

So, on a whim I pulled up the 2023 price increase justification feature matrix and merged it with the new one (comparing 2024 with a somewhat arbitrary 2019).

While this feature matrix is useful, I would add that not every feature that has been ticked off is equal. It also misses refinements, which can make a significant difference, but are hard to quantify. E. g. even the vanilla training plans have evolved significantly over time (and not just within the last year).

The second is the time scale: 2015 —> 2023 that’s 8 years of dev time whereas 2023 —> 2024 is evidently just one. Four major features in a year sounds pretty good to me.

@gcarver

I dunno, I guess I’m a little underwhelmed. The core functions continue to work well… ie, the “workout player”. The new stuff just seems like exactly the things you should be working on, but I don’t feel like the pace has improved any.

I don’t want to argue, just ask: why do you feel bummed out? TR has released 4 major features according to your chart, core functions “continue to work well”, yet you feel underwhelmed.

Would you want a new workout player, just because the old one hasn’t changed substantially in years (unless you are disabled)? Or are you bummed, because most (all?) new features aren’t changing your life? (E. g. I am not a triathlete, so I don’t really care about tri plans.) What would you want TR to work on?

I’m encouraged by @Nate_Pearson’s post, they work on a lot of the things I’d want them to work on:

• Include other sports and activities in RL/GL.
• Importing more sports.
• Plan Builder with volume recommendations based on RL/GL.
• WLv2

As well as a few others. Now I want those features yesterday, too, especially the ones I use

There are a few things that TR might or might not work on, but that I want for myself:

• Apple Health integration. How is it that I did a 90-minute sweet spot workout this morning and my Apple Health ring only includes my commute?!
• Sleep tracking. In my experience, long-term sleep patterns are the most important predictor of performance. If I don’t sleep properly for a while, my ability to perform and recover tanks.
• Consistency tracking.
• Integration of strength workouts. Other platforms have strength workouts included in their plans, and this is a giant gap IMHO. Why not collaborate with Derek from Dialed Health who seems to struggle to scale his business. @Nate_Pearson’s interest in strength training (he seems to have ditched cycling for it) makes me wonder whether he isn’t secretly working on something, though.

Apple Health integration has been promised for a long time. And it likely hinders tracking of other health metrics such as sleep patterns and HRV.

[rosko001]

@OreoCookie

ntegration of strength workouts. Other platforms have strength workouts included in their plans, and this is a giant gap IMHO. Why not collaborate with Derek from Dialed Health who seems to struggle to scale his business.

I like this idea a lot.

I use the TR Strength Benchmarks as a sole metric for my workouts - it seems good, but I don’t know enough to know any different. Having some strength expertise within the TR ecosystem would be gold.

[alexfthenakis]

@Nate_Pearson

I wanted to let the forum give their opinion on whether this is fair or not or if they had any other thoughts before we made our final decision.

@Power13

never ask for a price increase…you just do it. Few customers will ever willingly agree to pay more and by opening it up for discussion, it creates friction.

It is best done with a clear explanation of why and any additional justification to support the increase.

@mcneese.chad

asking if people are OK with it

I’m getting into semantics here, but as I read it Nate made no pretense about asking for our permission or approval - he asked what thoughts we have, which is different. Maybe an opportunity for Nate to further clarify phrasing going forward, but even as-is I really appreciate what he’s done here (and his general ethos with customer messaging and communication).

As a privately owned company with Nate in control it’s a dictatorship, not a democracy. That’s not going to change under current circumstances so I really appreciate that Nate doesn’t talk about it like it’s anything else.

I really hate that language of “this is for you, this product isn’t about me, it’s about the users, you all make it what it is so it belongs to you” etc. when the reality is that the dynamic is actually nothing of the sort. It makes me feel like I’m being mis-sold and I lose trust in the person saying those things.

At the other end of the spectrum I really hate getting the sense of a distant and aloof ‘dictator’ who is entirely opaque about how and why they arrive at the decisions they take. That makes me feel like they’re taking my continued business for granted and have no interest in their customers or how to serve them.

While you’ve never used these exact words @Nate_Pearson, I’ve always had a clear understanding from you that the structure is, “I’m the dictator and I’ll make whatever decision I’m going to make based on whatever factors I decide to consider, but I really want to understand my customer base and really listen to and consider what you have to say before I choose my next move.” It shows me that you appreciate the fact that our trust in you and our spend on your product is earned and can be lost, and that you value it accordingly - no more and no less. Your transparency about all of that and about what ultimately ends up influencing your choices also does an excellent job of keeping my trust in you and the product/company even when you make individual decisions/changes I don’t like.

Kudos for that. It’s a fine line to walk and, while there’s always room for improvement, I think you’re one of the better examples of self-aware and continuously-reflective leadership available to us.