Hi everyone, I joined TR early November. I’m 59, recreational road cyclist. Did a ramp test November 2nd and it came out at 185 - and am 185 pounds reasonably fit. I set up a program for two months. I just finished that program this weekend. It had me cycling four hours per week. On non-cycling days I would do 100 push-ups, 10 to 15 minutes of core and 20 minutes of flexibility. Followed this routine consistently and did the ai FTP estimate. It estimated my FTP to be at 199. Just did another ramp test and it came in at 198. So all good.
I’m taking the next week and a half off as I’ll be traveling. I’ve now set up a three month program starting early January with the objective to increase FTP. It looks like it has me doing four hours of cycling per week again.
But here’s the thing, my Vo2 Max is going down. It was about 36 late summer. And now just under 33. I’d like both increase both Vo2 max and FTP by the spring. Can someone suggest a TR training program that would help me accomplish both. I have no hard target for either metric. I just would like them both to increase together. I’d be willing to cycle up to five hours per week, but probably not much more. But 4hrs per week works out well or at least four times per week works out well with my schedule. Ideas?
While there are definitely way more knowledgeable and professional folks around there, here’s my basic amateur explanation.
I think what you are currently doing will already help you achieve both of your goals.
Unless you are doing proper medical tests for your vo2max, it’s most likely a calculated estimate based around other factors like your heart rate or 5min max power.
During your training there may be phases where these calculations show a decline in value, purely due to the particular workouts you have been doing. I’d not worry about this to much. As long as you exercise and notice your fitness rising, e.g. by rising FTP estimates, your VO2max will also follow along in the long-term trend.
Generally speaking, LT1, LT2 and VO2 Max move together. You can focus on one and move that needle more than the others, but ultimately, there’s a limit to how far you can push each one without moving the others.
Sometimes, athletes might feel a bit “stuck” in terms of fitness, and then try to figure out which of those three they need to focus on to break through.
In terms of general fitness though and overall training enjoyment, a general training plan can take you far.
How do you know your VO2max? I bet you are having it estimated by your Garmin or something from your cycling efforts. Basically you need cycling power to do that. My understanding is that some sort of short maximum effort is best. There are algorithms to estimate VO2max from a sub-maximal effort, but I’d expect the predictive accuracy to be less than if you used a max effort.
Anyway, you were probably riding harder in the summer. People tend to be in their base phase around now. I have a couple of short-duration max efforts because I was doing some power testing, but I know I can do more watts over 5 mins when I’m in shape compared to what my critical power model estimates right now. So, that’s probably your answer. And the prescription would be don’t worry about it, just stick to whatever you were going to do for your base phase.
I mean, don’t have a TR account, but I was under the impression that you still do some VO2max work during the base phase? If so, that’s likely going to pull your estimated VO2max up.
Interesting. I’m getting it from my Apple Watch. Have a friend at a Vo2 of 50 that did a lab test. She said her watch was just about 50 as well. Am assuming it’s “”about”” correct.
The average age in the US is 38. I have a friend that is 38 and it’s spot on for him. Just because someone fits the algorithm, median/bell curve, doesn’t indicate accuracy.
I think Garmin has me at 61 or 62 and its been as highcas 77 (I think it was 71 kast year). The Garmin still had me at 48 in the middle of a catastrophic iron deficiency. The Apple watch sounds more inline with how I feel
PS Merry Christmas
Exactly this. Apple only uses walk, run, or hike data to calculate VO2. I’m at 40 based on the watch, using a 6’30" max cycling power calculator, I’m at 54. I haven’t done a lab test so don’t know which one is ‘right’, but I’m more inclined to look at one that includes my bike efforts than one that disregards them given that I don’t run.
The plan to increase your “fitness” (FTP/VO2) is to stay consistent. Don’t slack off for weeks at a time unless it’s an actual rest week. Then increase your volume/training load.
All types of training, even easy endurance riding, increase fitness. At four hours per week, you have a lot of room for an increase in volume. Pros train 20-30 hours per week. Fast amateurs are often pushing 15 hours per week. At four hours per week, you can go to 5 or 6 or 8 hours for some gains when you are ready. Keep following a plan and do one or two interval workouts per week. Do some longer rides - once a week or even every other week is great. Do a 2, 3, 4+ hour ride - whatever is long for you.
Someone posted this link in another topics. It’s everything that is scientifically proven to work with links to studies.
The recap is:
1. Ensure consistency first
2. Increase your training load
3. Balance your intensity distribution
4. Apply basic principles of periodizing & tapering
5. Finally, worry about the devil in the details
People that just want to be fit and have fun on the bike can mostly focus on 1-3. #4 can be applied to training for specific events / racing.
Here’s the thing with garmin vo2 estimates: they change day to day based on (I believe) aerobic efficiency. I did an endurance ride today and my vo2 score went up by one because I had a bigger pwr/hr ratio. So simply riding more can help with aerobic efficiency
I don’t have access to that article, but if they showed a prediction interval (a Bland-Altman plot with the 95% limits of agreement), I suspect you’d see something like that equation predicts VO2max within around +/- 10 mL O2/kg min.
I don’t know what the prediction intervals for Garmin and Apple are. I would suspect that if you don’t have maximal efforts, they’d likely be larger.
To some extent, does it matter? We are already doing activities that would tend to pull our VO2maxes up. My estimated VO2max is 55 (estimated from intervals.icu, which uses one of the cycling power algorithms). Say it’s actually only 45. That’s already pretty good. In terms of longevity gains, I’m likely in the region of declining performance. The OP is a lot newer to TR, and maybe to cycling in general. So, their estimated VO2max is probably lower. The thing is, they’re already doing the thing that would pull it up. “Only” have 5 hours per week? That’s not a deal breaker, just be consistent, keep working to improve, but don’t burn out. Cheat meals once in a while, too!
